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Thread: ATSV Throttle body Closing

  1. #21
    Advanced Tuner lt1z350's Avatar
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    Normc5 I pulled a plug and looked great no signs of kr if that's what your referring to.


    The Buick I believe is like the early ats 2.0t and runs an e39a ecm the vsport runs the same e92 as atsv. The later model ats and buick may have went to it too not sure. Under diagnostic tables it has the boost under and over speed tables. Which I don't normally go scoping through all that but now glad I did. I did raise all the torque tables about 200 across the board rather then maxing out like did in early stuff. So think I hit what your referring to.
    With no tcm support yet I am trying to sort of trick it into keeping throttle closed and timing up setting stuff like minimum timing at wot shift rpm up higher so can't pull so much timing on shifts. Yet to figure out anything for the closing throttle though at least when shifting just no trick that I can come up with.
    I guess someone with some real smarts could find a way to mess with the actual signs it sees. Just sit and wait for tcm support I guess.
    Last edited by lt1z350; 03-01-2017 at 06:19 AM.
    First 9 second 6th gen lt4 zl1 stock blower SHC SBE boost only.

    2013 cadillac ats 2.0t Big turbo-gone
    2007 tahoe 5.3 lsa blower on 14 lbs boost 6l80e swap 2009 os
    2017 zl1 a10 big gulp/2 inch headers/ 9.55 lower/ e85/bigger hx /103mm tb / Synergy trunk tank and underhood kit/methanol injection with torqbyte controller and prometh pump / Jokerz performance R&D ported stock blower/ lme cnc heads /GP tuning custom cam. So far 9.30@150

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by machineworks View Post
    Can't seem to figure out why the TB is closing to 46% when I raise the boost. I have tired raising the Driver Demand in AB and C tables.
    Quote Originally Posted by NYLS1346 View Post
    I've been playing with a 2016 atsv and cannot get the tb to stay open either.. there is no desired map table and only way to get the boost up is increasing the throttle pressure drop but once i do that it closes the throttle on me.. played with DD tables and all of the boost limits and base duty cycle.. not sure if im missing something
    Quote Originally Posted by VO2max View Post
    Has anyone figured this out? We are seeing the same thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by 30thta436 View Post
    I am having the same issue. I have raised peak tq and the driver demand tables. what table am I missing?
    Quote Originally Posted by FastEddy View Post
    Having throttle issues as well on an ATS-V right now. Max'd out all the knock airmass just to eliminate that from my equation, and still have throttle closing. I'm not really getting an KR in my wot anyways so I assumed that probably wasn't my issue. But felt it was worth mentioning.
    The throttle is closing because Actual Boost is exceeding Desired Boost. So you need to increase Desired Boost via a combination of changes to the Driver Demand, Knock Airmass and some other tables.
    2022 Cadillac CT5-V Blackwing (733 whp)
    2022 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing (716 whp), 10.750 @ 134.77 mph
    2016 Cadillac ATS-Vs (eleven ATS-Vs in the 9s)
    2008 Pontiac G8 (first G8 in the 10s), 10.727 @ 129.87 mph
    2000 Bonneville SSEi (first 3800 Bonneville in the 10s), 10.711 @ 125.71 mph
    1999 Grand Prix GT (first 3800 FWD in the 8s), 8.902 @ 154.90 mph
    1998 Firebird (first 3800 RWD in the 8s), 843 whp, 8.991 @ 152.12 mph
    1998 Grand Prix GTP (first 3800 FWD in the 10s), 9.499 @ 145.13 mph

  3. #23
    Advanced Tuner lt1z350's Avatar
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    its not just that being the issue if you log your delivered torque and max torque values the second the delivered gets to the max torque it will drop the boost if fast torque exit is disabled or will close the throttle if its not maxed out. Been working with a 2017 ats 2.0t and does the same thing no matter where you try to put the dc table. I have dont a lot of early 2.0t stuff and wasnt near the problem as this new e92 or e80 logic. You can trick it somewhat by setting your target lower and letting it overboost but still no matter what you do you cant get it to hold your commanded boost as it will eventually build more torque then max torque is allowing. Im playing with virtual torque editor now to try to figure this out as its a throttle and timing issue on non boosted v8 and somewhat on my 2017 zl1 with more boost and e85. This is my channel list that will give all the tuning school current channels and layout that will provide you with the data to see what it is doing. If you think yours is not doing this would you please log with it and post it up so I can look at the data????? As a community if can figure this out life will be easier when doing new over head cam v8 turbo stuff as will have it figured out now. Every "professional" tune I have seen has this problem when I take that tuned car use my channel list and my layout and look at it. you see it drop the boost or close the throttle always one or the other some do both. Customer things it feels better then stock so good with it but it isnt right. If look at my screen shot will see how it starts building boost fast soon as torque crosses the max it closes the throttle to first knock down boost then opens it back up but keeps boost down to maintain the delivered around max towards the end of the pull can see boost going back up it did that as delivered stayed below max for a little bit then started to feed boost back into it. I know v8 guys fight this same issue when put a supercharger on a non boosted tune they seem to make it ok under wot but wont drive worth a shit and surges as it keeps pulling timing when this happens or closes part throttle and surges from that.
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    First 9 second 6th gen lt4 zl1 stock blower SHC SBE boost only.

    2013 cadillac ats 2.0t Big turbo-gone
    2007 tahoe 5.3 lsa blower on 14 lbs boost 6l80e swap 2009 os
    2017 zl1 a10 big gulp/2 inch headers/ 9.55 lower/ e85/bigger hx /103mm tb / Synergy trunk tank and underhood kit/methanol injection with torqbyte controller and prometh pump / Jokerz performance R&D ported stock blower/ lme cnc heads /GP tuning custom cam. So far 9.30@150

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by lt1z350 View Post
    its not just that being the issue if you log your delivered torque and max torque values the second the delivered gets to the max torque it will drop the boost if fast torque exit is disabled or will close the throttle if its not maxed out. Been working with a 2017 ats 2.0t and does the same thing no matter where you try to put the dc table. I have dont a lot of early 2.0t stuff and wasnt near the problem as this new e92 or e80 logic. You can trick it somewhat by setting your target lower and letting it overboost but still no matter what you do you cant get it to hold your commanded boost as it will eventually build more torque then max torque is allowing. Im playing with virtual torque editor now to try to figure this out as its a throttle and timing issue on non boosted v8 and somewhat on my 2017 zl1 with more boost and e85. This is my channel list that will give all the tuning school current channels and layout that will provide you with the data to see what it is doing. If you think yours is not doing this would you please log with it and post it up so I can look at the data????? As a community if can figure this out life will be easier when doing new over head cam v8 turbo stuff as will have it figured out now. Every "professional" tune I have seen has this problem when I take that tuned car use my channel list and my layout and look at it. you see it drop the boost or close the throttle always one or the other some do both. Customer things it feels better then stock so good with it but it isnt right. If look at my screen shot will see how it starts building boost fast soon as torque crosses the max it closes the throttle to first knock down boost then opens it back up but keeps boost down to maintain the delivered around max towards the end of the pull can see boost going back up it did that as delivered stayed below max for a little bit then started to feed boost back into it. I know v8 guys fight this same issue when put a supercharger on a non boosted tune they seem to make it ok under wot but wont drive worth a shit and surges as it keeps pulling timing when this happens or closes part throttle and surges from that.
    Notice that your throttle is closing exactly when your boost is peaking. Why don't you add the Desired Boost parameter to your log? I have not tuned an ATS 2.0T, but would not be surprised if this is your issue.
    2022 Cadillac CT5-V Blackwing (733 whp)
    2022 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing (716 whp), 10.750 @ 134.77 mph
    2016 Cadillac ATS-Vs (eleven ATS-Vs in the 9s)
    2008 Pontiac G8 (first G8 in the 10s), 10.727 @ 129.87 mph
    2000 Bonneville SSEi (first 3800 Bonneville in the 10s), 10.711 @ 125.71 mph
    1999 Grand Prix GT (first 3800 FWD in the 8s), 8.902 @ 154.90 mph
    1998 Firebird (first 3800 RWD in the 8s), 843 whp, 8.991 @ 152.12 mph
    1998 Grand Prix GTP (first 3800 FWD in the 10s), 9.499 @ 145.13 mph

  5. #25
    Advanced Tuner lt1z350's Avatar
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    its remote and I dont have his off line so trying to show him how to look for paremerters on it and add it to the next log and dc boost so can see if matching up to what the dc table it commanding or not. Most pulls its not closing the throttle at all or just a tiny dip but even on stock dc table it will hit 19 psi and fall to 14. So adding to allowed pressure delta and adding to the dc table so that it by theory add to commanded boost it still will peak 20-21 then fall to 14-15 every time that delivered goes over the max value. Its that max value being low is dropping the boost down. The tuning school new direct injection books say to raise virtual torque to raise max torque but also finding doing that will push up the delivered along with max. So max torque is a combined table made up of many is what they are saying as it inst simple like the Peak torque or over boost torque tables. SO I see on the max timiing torque tables it even says its part of the "final torque calculation" so going to raise that on the next tune and see how the log comes out. He says it feels really good and 0-60 dropped about a second but I know more is in the tune. If boost was to stay at 21 and only twitch on the shifts this car will pick up another 20-30 hp across the board as the boost is constantly down. All old logs I have that I added my layout over show this happening. I have a new era atsv tune and log from a guys car and you would laugh if saw that one and what they tried to do.
    Since I have you here and yours seems pretty good I am guessing did you enable the maf on yours as all these late model turbo cars have it at 7000 which then puts it all on the vve rather then maf for changes. I thought about setting it to 300-400 and going maf priority and see how it liked it. Never tried that on one of these turbo cars, I will tell you this as was told from a gm engineer there is no sd on these new cars. They all use the maf in calculations no matter how you do it tune it same with no maf only it will always use the vve to pull from for reference even virtual torque falls on the vve from what I understand. People seem to tune around these issues rather then figure out hte right way to do it. Trying to find an old log from an atsv that was 19 psi and dynoed well to reference on this whole subject.
    First 9 second 6th gen lt4 zl1 stock blower SHC SBE boost only.

    2013 cadillac ats 2.0t Big turbo-gone
    2007 tahoe 5.3 lsa blower on 14 lbs boost 6l80e swap 2009 os
    2017 zl1 a10 big gulp/2 inch headers/ 9.55 lower/ e85/bigger hx /103mm tb / Synergy trunk tank and underhood kit/methanol injection with torqbyte controller and prometh pump / Jokerz performance R&D ported stock blower/ lme cnc heads /GP tuning custom cam. So far 9.30@150

  6. #26
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    Any updates on the fix for the throttle closure and holding boost?

    Rev

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theereverand
    Any updates on the fix for the throttle closure and holding boost?
    I responded to your email this morning. We have these and all other issues compeltely resolved with regard to ATS-V tuning.
    Last edited by Tapout Tuning; 08-09-2020 at 05:52 PM.
    2022 Cadillac CT5-V Blackwing (733 whp)
    2022 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing (716 whp), 10.750 @ 134.77 mph
    2016 Cadillac ATS-Vs (eleven ATS-Vs in the 9s)
    2008 Pontiac G8 (first G8 in the 10s), 10.727 @ 129.87 mph
    2000 Bonneville SSEi (first 3800 Bonneville in the 10s), 10.711 @ 125.71 mph
    1999 Grand Prix GT (first 3800 FWD in the 8s), 8.902 @ 154.90 mph
    1998 Firebird (first 3800 RWD in the 8s), 843 whp, 8.991 @ 152.12 mph
    1998 Grand Prix GTP (first 3800 FWD in the 10s), 9.499 @ 145.13 mph