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Thread: Idle Tuning How-To & Guide (w/pictures)

  1. #81
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    Like this.. I also change the error correction. Depending on how they want the idle, I might go 1-5*. Stock is like 1-14* or something and I've seen it as high as 35* I think...?

    timing.jpg

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by waynehartwig View Post
    Like this.. I also change the error correction. Depending on how they want the idle, I might go 1-5*. Stock is like 1-14* or something and I've seen it as high as 35* I think...?

    timing.jpg
    That is a nice looking timing table! What kind of engine is that table from, what kind of compression ratio? That is alot of timing in the high load/rpm areas, I wish I could get that high without knock!

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by NBMLS2TA View Post
    That is a nice looking timing table! What kind of engine is that table from, what kind of compression ratio? That is alot of timing in the high load/rpm areas, I wish I could get that high without knock!
    My race car runs that with 12:1 cr on pump gas. There is more to tuning than just cranking the timing up

    976857_695763827107108_1985036525_o.jpg
    Last edited by waynehartwig; 08-22-2013 at 06:59 PM.

  4. #84
    Tuner Pur_SSyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by waynehartwig View Post
    There is more to tuning than just cranking the timing up

    976857_695763827107108_1985036525_o.jpg
    No doubt. Those that have done dyno tuning, and/or track tuning know that the best timing is not always, "just before knock". I see quite a bit of that referenced in tuning threads.
    2013 GTM Gen.1
    Modified LQ9 w/G96.00

  5. #85
    Advanced Tuner VodeAn's Avatar
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    Thanks for the write up OP, very detailed.

  6. #86
    This was and is a very good read. Very informative.

  7. #87
    Advanced Tuner Rinkrat456's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LSCha0s View Post
    Great info..This is my first post .. I'm subscribing
    Quote Originally Posted by Montecarlodrag View Post
    This is a very good source of information.
    I wanted this information saved as HTML for offline use, but the pictures were too large to fit the screen and the text didn't fit either so I needed to scroll over and over.

    This PDF file I made is this exact same information but with a little formatting and cropped/resized pictures to fit the screen for easy reading.

    Thanks for sharing this information.

    Here is the file if anyone wants to have it for offline use.

    Change .hpt to .pdf file extension
    Quote Originally Posted by que4dog View Post
    New to GM & great Info. Working with a C5 Z06 w TSP 233/239 Cam .595/.603 112LSA. The Tune the car came with seems to run and idle rich and LTFTs still adding fuel. I'll give this a try.
    Quote Originally Posted by frankmarroquin View Post
    Good thread
    Quote Originally Posted by sunny View Post
    Thanks for the time and information in this post.
    I’m curious as to why you lower the O2 sensor switching points in the big overlap cam section to lean the idle when you already have the car in OLSD up to 1,200 RPMs? It would seem that to O2s are out of the picture below 1,200 RPMs. Wouldn’t that cause the properly tuned car to go lean at part throttle cruising speeds above just 1200 RPMs?
    Quote Originally Posted by Farmer2 View Post
    This thread was outstanding for us struggling with rich idle.
    My issue was 12.3 AFR @ idle, found that the idle grams were about 4 high across the scale. I did the cfg scan from cold, copy and pasted to the idle air chart and brought it to 15.2. Then lowered to the final of about 7.1 grams to get my 14.6.

    Thanks again for helping / posting up this!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by Motion427 View Post
    I used this idle tuning guide before,works great. Thank You!!!!
    But last week,I was working on a LS1 T/A with a mild 222/226 cam,and it did not worked at all.
    Once the VE and MAF were dialed in.
    I had to add 40-50% of base running airflow for it to idle correctly.I got it 90-95% OK,but not 100% perfect.
    Couldn't figure out why it needed the extra airflow for it to idle.
    But I noticed that their was a hole that was drilled in the TB about 1/4 inch or a bit bigger. I'm guessing this is the issue.
    Any suggestions to fix it 100% ? Or just keep guessing the base running airflow?
    The way it is now,when I log the idle adapt (STIT) sometimes it's as much as -50's, and example,the idle desired airflow is 1.2 and I have to set the base running airflow to 1.5-1.7 for it to idle.
    Thanks in advance.

    Edit:I also tried to add 4-5% of fuel on the VE table and MAF at idle.Redid the idle tuning,the base running airflow and the desired airflow matched perfect and it idled perfect.So I was wondering if I should fix it this way?
    Quote Originally Posted by TrailBlazer SS AWD View Post
    Great Info.
    Quote Originally Posted by VodeAn View Post
    Thanks for the write up OP, very detailed.
    Quote Originally Posted by monte4ever View Post
    This was and is a very good read. Very informative.
    You're all very welcome. Glad I could give back to the HPT forum.

    Sorry to all for being absent lately, I've taken a bit of a back seat to tuning over the last year and a half. Military duty, moving all over the country and getting married really changes your focuses...for awhile. I've recently gotten back into vehicle work and I'm glad to see this thread has helped so many.

    PLEASE continue to contribute tips, tips and ideas for making this a more informative thread. I just re-read through everything I wrote and re-learned a thing or two myself lol.

    Good to see this is still helping people.
    -Patrick
    Click for >>Idle Tuning Guide

  8. #88
    Forgive me if this has already been answered but I have a question regarding overlap. Do you use the advertised lift numbers or at 0.050? My overlap varies from +46 dregrees down to -6 degrees depending on which one I use. Thanks!

  9. #89
    Anybody?

  10. #90
    Advanced Tuner 68Camaro's Avatar
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    duration @ .050

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by 68Camaro View Post
    duration @ .050
    Thanks!!!

  12. #92
    This might be a dumb question, but is idle tuning the same for SD and cars with a MAF? I just installed an Isky 218 cam and I'm struggling to get the idle right. I'm just about ready to put my LS6 cam back in the car.

  13. #93
    I had a question on commanding the AFR at 14.7 @ idle with the PE Table. I've seen several other posts about fattening up the PE table to ensure you don't run too lean.

    What's the preferred method? Setting to 1 and then tuning with the MAF/VE Table? I'm running a cam with 16 degrees of overlap and it's not entirely possible to get an accurate A/F measurement at idle. I know I can adjust the VE table (running in OLSD) but was just wondering what the advantage would be of setting the PE table to anything other than 1.

  14. #94
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    if any of you guys can help me with thois idle rev surge i need the help bad

  15. #95
    Tuner Pur_SSyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by macc10 View Post
    if any of you guys can help me with thois idle rev surge i need the help bad
    You'll have to provide the files before anyone can start to help...
    2013 GTM Gen.1
    Modified LQ9 w/G96.00

  16. #96
    Finally got my fbody together and starting to tune it. This is my first attempt at a LSx tune, so criticism is appreciated. I am migrating over from the LNF 4cyl turbo platform and this is a bit different. I am currently having problems getting my manifold pressure up as well. Can't tell if it is tune related or a vacuum leak. I can not find a leak anywhere, so if anyone could take a look at my file and log and provide criticism it would be appreciated. Currently dialing in the RAF as well. I also need to mess with the set screw to bring down my IAC as well.

    99 Camaro
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    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by Dayhoff35; 10-29-2014 at 10:05 PM.

  17. #97
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    This is very informative.. Good Info

  18. #98
    very good info here this needs to be a sticky

  19. #99
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    i dont have anything to really offer but this was one of my favorite threads so i printed it off to hold in my hand while i made changes in vehicle.
    i decided all i could do was offer a PDF version of the first couple posts describing what to do since the pictures went down. I printed it on a laser printer so its all black and white sorry guys.
    Thanks for the great thread.

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bwx...ew?usp=sharing
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

  20. #100
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    This is actually my first post on here, but I thought I would share some tips on tuning the GEN III dreaded 98 Camaro pcm. I have a 0411 in the mail as I type this, but this is relevant for any IAC car I think. Many people seem to skip the IAC Steps vs Effective Area table, perhaps because the numbers in it are almost impossible to assign a value to. Through forums and other sites and tinkering I came up with a decent way of tuning the IAC steps to reflect more accurate Desired Airflow.

    Changing a cam changes vacuum. Therefore, desired airflow through the stepper motor is not going to be accurate without tuning the steps table. This gives your computer more accurate information and lessens the need to adjust other tables to compensate for the error.

    Step 1. Tune your VE table in SD mode until it is +/- 5 (or less) at idle on your WB

    Step 2. Reduce your IAC steps to 40-60 at operating temp, (lower than this won't hurt). Do this by opening the throttle blade slowly. Remember to reset your IAC motor and TPS after every adjustment. Your idle might get very high while adjusting the blade. Just shut off the car, reset, and start the car. Seems to work on mine, as it will drive the IAC counts down. For 98-02 F bodies, do not exceed .55v on your TPS sensor. It will cause an error. If you still need to bring TPS voltage down, simply loosen the screws and turn it. If required, enlarge the holes SLIGHTLY and remove the centering stub to give more adjustability over the voltage range. The overall goal is to lower the IAC counts in order to give the PCM more control over the idle.

    Step 3. Go to your scanner. Go to Tools>Math Parameters and select a "User Defined" PID under "Maths-user". Now click "new variable" and select "Idle Desired Airflow" (2220.71), then "Dynamic Airflow" (2320.71), and "Idle Air Control Position" (2200). The Equation is: Idle Desired/Dynamic*IAC position. It should look like this: [2220.71]/[2320.71]*[2200]. Name this PID IAC correction.

    Step 4. Make sure you are logging Dynamic, Idle desired, and IAC Control Position.

    Step 5. Create a new histogram graph using your new IAC PID. Under the Column Axis use "Idle Air Control Position." Here's the fun part. For the values, the PCM does not tell you the actual "position" of the motor. It tells you what it thinks it is, i.e., "effective area." This could be anything from 0-310. The fun part is figuring out really what step "310" or any other value actually is since there are only 120 steps. SO, what you have to do is assign "values" to your axis. On the Column Axis you can go by whatever numeral you want, but by 5 seems to work just fine. I go by 2's and even 1's in some areas. Basically you need to enter values from 1-310 in this axis in any form you want, since the motor will "see" any number of them. The more the better. Set your hit count to 25. It should look like this: 1, 5, 10, 15, etc... ...310.

    Step 6. (Optional) Add a TPS and Dynamic AF filter to your log. Something like: [50090.156] < 0.5 AND [2320.71] < 30 This will allow you to log while driving

    Step 7. Do a cold start with the car, and try to avoid stepping on the gas. Mine hates to start cold, so the first few seconds are a wash for me, I just start the scan once the car is running on it's own after a few seconds. It's something I've been trying to fix, but big cam and crappy PCM are not helping lol.

    Step 8. Look at your log, go to your tune file and find the numbers that match the closest from the tune and the log. Example: in your 170 column is says 130. Find the value in your "IAC Steps vs. Effective Area" table that is closest to 170, and change it to 130. Do this for as many numbers as possible, smooth as needed. Interpolate works great for some of the areas here if you don't have values to go off of. You just need to make sure it's a slope and not a mountain range. *NOTE* You should get higher counts when the engine is cold, and lower counts as it warms up (motor closes). Do this for a few days over a few starts. Look at your Dynamic and Desired Airflow values. They should start to come together. Repeat as necessary.

    Step 9. Adjust your RAF (Base Running Airflow) Table. Plenty of write-ups on this, including using the Russ K config file.