Self tuning my 22 Whipple GT 10R80 - Opinions on my tune file welcome.

Hey all. Been working on learning and testing my tuning skills on my 22GT. Car was originally tuned by Wengerd, but I wanted to start learning how to tune on my own so I could make tweaks to the tune at the track or whenever I wanted. Car is a 22 GT 10R80 with a stage 1 whipple/3.875 pulley, catless TSP LTHs and its currently on e30 blend. Only fuel mods are GT500 FIC1000h injectors that fit under the whipple as recommended by beefcake.

Car is a 401a full weight with only a 305/45/17 ET street SS and I have been a best of 10.20@137 on my tune at BMP in about 250da.

Attaching my tune file for opinions. Wengerd wouldnt send me my tune he did, but he was nice enough to send me a pure base file to where my car would run and be safe for WOT. But had basically nothing else done. I had to tweak almost everything else myself accept the MAF and injector stuff that we already were using.

All the rest and the entire trans side is my piecing it all together from anywhere and anyone that would share help, advice and other tune files. The idea of information sharing means everything to me. Im in IT by trade as a senior network engineer, and would never have gotten to the level I am at professionally without others along the years helping and sharing their tribal knowledge.

So posting my tune as its in the car currently. Feel free to shoot me any constructive criticism, advice or straight help if you see its needed. Wengerd still takes my calls thank goodness, but hes a busy guy and has way over extended the money I've paid him for his services. I always have my pure Wengerd tunes in my TDN app I can fall back on, but I really like to be able to play with my tune as I get bored or want to try something.

Check it out. I will attach my stock tune as well for anyone that needs a stock 22 GT 10R80 file. Also a quick driving log with a single short WOT pull for reference.

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Originally Posted by VetRider

Hey all. Been working on learning and testing my tuning skills on my 22GT. Car was originally tuned by Wengerd, but I wanted to start learning how to tune on my own so I could make tweaks to the tune at the track or whenever I wanted. Car is a 22 GT 10R80 with a stage 1 whipple/3.875 pulley, catless TSP LTHs and its currently on e30 blend. Only fuel mods are GT500 FIC1000h injectors that fit under the whipple as recommended by beefcake.

Car is a 401a full weight with only a 305/45/17 ET street SS and I have been a best of 10.20@137 on my tune at BMP in about 250da.

Attaching my tune file for opinions. Wengerd wouldnt send me my tune he did, but he was nice enough to send me a pure base file to where my car would run and be safe for WOT. But had basically nothing else done. I had to tweak almost everything else myself accept the MAF and injector stuff that we already were using.

All the rest and the entire trans side is my piecing it all together from anywhere and anyone that would share help, advice and other tune files. The idea of information sharing means everything to me. Im in IT by trade as a senior network engineer, and would never have gotten to the level I am at professionally without others along the years helping and sharing their tribal knowledge.

So posting my tune as its in the car currently. Feel free to shoot me any constructive criticism, advice or straight help if you see its needed. Wengerd still takes my calls thank goodness, but hes a busy guy and has way over extended the money I've paid him for his services. I always have my pure Wengerd tunes in my TDN app I can fall back on, but I really like to be able to play with my tune as I get bored or want to try something.

Check it out. I will attach my stock tune as well for anyone that needs a stock 22 GT 10R80 file. Also a quick driving log with a single short WOT pull for reference.

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Here's a good 2-3-4 WOT pull on e30 from tonight. The car is just an animal. Shifts on point.

Sounds like it's running really good. Anything youre wanting to try and fix or change ?

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Originally Posted by Pistol_91

Sounds like it's running really good. Anything youre wanting to try and fix or change ?

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Im always looking to try and smooth out drivibility with the trans. So far nothing I've done makes it more intuitive for part throttle shifting. Lots of clunks and quirky downshifting as you are coming to a stop. I have tried settings from the 24 GT10R80, and I have a few actual whipple tunes. Their trans settings are ok, not great. So currently Im running on the more aggressive side of the trans tuning.

I also see you're in clearwater. Im in Land O lakes. Small world. Do you tune for a shop or privately or just your own stuff? I race at bradenton all the time on the thursday night test and tunes.

Tq reductions on shifts are basically off - hope your trans is build...

Tq model indicated is LOW - 650Nm is what a stock car on e85 could see - tables are hacked on high range

Quote:

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Originally Posted by VetRider

Im always looking to try and smooth out drivibility with the trans. So far nothing I've done makes it more intuitive for part throttle shifting. Lots of clunks and quirky downshifting as you are coming to a stop. I have tried settings from the 24 GT10R80, and I have a few actual whipple tunes. Their trans settings are ok, not great. So currently Im running on the more aggressive side of the trans tuning.

I also see you're in clearwater. Im in Land O lakes. Small world. Do you tune for a shop or privately or just your own stuff? I race at bradenton all the time on the thursday night test and tunes.

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Yeah def a small world and pretty much my own stuff. A few friends N/A cars nothing crazy. Im not super versed with the 10r80 transmission. I only know the basics, maybe someone else can chime in for smoothing that out.

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Originally Posted by veeefour

Tq reductions on shifts are basically off - hope your trans is build...

Tq model indicated is LOW - 650Nm is what a stock car on e85 could see - tables are hacked on high range

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Can you get a little more specific maybe give me an example I can work off of from my own tune. I?m super new to all this. Any help is appreciated.

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Originally Posted by VetRider

Can you get a little more specific maybe give me an example I can work off of from my own tune. I?m super new to all this. Any help is appreciated.

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More specific your torque model shows 650Nm which is low because upper part of torque model tables is incorrect.
This is fine for low boost but it can lead into low pressure in transmission as trans base pressure on torque...but on the other hand you have zero tq reductions on shifts.
Running this way you should have at least upgraded clutches but punching over 800Nm with no tq reduction will toast clutches sooner or later.

Can you share a screenshot of what you?re talking about. I spent the whole of yesterday trying to figure out what and where in the tune you are referring to the 650nm tq model and also the tq reduction. My inexperience here is holding me back and a nice firm push from someone who knows would be a huge help. As far as I can tell the tq tables are all different and there are many of them. And tq reduction in shifts is that the tq modulation for 1-2, 2-3 and so on? What are those values supposed to be then? All the numbers in any of those tables all seem arbitrary to me. I?ve yet to be able to figure out what they are supposed to be other than maxed out.

try to apply custom patch of hp tuners to get tansbrake :D

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Originally Posted by mo74ji

try to apply custom patch of hp tuners to get tansbrake :D

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Yeah no lol. I only have GT350 axles and I dont want to sacrifice them to the transbrake gods. Not at 700hp+ to the rear wheels.

Where in the tune I would say its limited. A load request limit.

Attachment 142095

The 650NM limit in the logs

Attachment 142096

Where he wants you to modify

Attachment 142097

Its a never ending cycle

Quote:

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Originally Posted by murfie

Where in the tune I would say its limited. A load request limit.

Attachment 142095

The 650NM limit in the logs

Attachment 142096

Where he wants you to modify

Attachment 142097

Its a never ending cycle

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100% correct

I was assuming thats where you were going with this, but my car at WOT is arount 1.55-1.60 airload, which should put it well above that 650nm tq in that table no? Im super confused as to what it should be then. This is a part of the tune thats quite a mystery to me. When you start from stock, how do you know what to bump and to what level? Do you just multiple the bottom few rows by 1.01% and inch them up as a group?

And for the inverse table, the inverse calc in the editor will only do the entire table not just the bottom. What do I do in that situation? Is there a spreadsheet you need to create to assist here in pushing the numbers to the correct limits without effecting the bottom rows? I need a bit more information if you are willing to share.

Attachment 142102

Quote:

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Originally Posted by murfie

Where in the tune I would say its limited. A load request limit.

Attachment 142095

The 650NM limit in the logs

Attachment 142096

Where he wants you to modify

Attachment 142097

Its a never ending cycle

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Murfie,

How much should the aircharge multiplier be increased? Should the maximum load under SD also be increased?

I looked at a stock tune for a 2020 GT500 and the aircharge multiplier is 1 for a lot of the mapped points. Really interesting.

Thank you!

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Originally Posted by 1810R80

Murfie,

How much should the aircharge multiplier be increased? Should the maximum load under SD also be increased?

I looked at a stock tune for a 2020 GT500 and the aircharge multiplier is 1 for a lot of the mapped points. Really interesting.

Thank you!

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The factory supercharged and turboed cars have throttle inlet pressure sensors. This allows them to keep a negative pressure differential relationship from barometric pressure across the throttle body known as ETC vacuum. You probably just have MAP max delta above BP, which allows for cyclinder filling to be correct, but is not good enough for the throttle body model out side of WOT.

You can modify the effective area of the TB model. although its feedforward and you would need to disable Driver Demand feedback loop all the time. Going solely off the TB model isn't good for control in high vacuum/ idle areas. Most going this route just shoot for WOT start around 40-50. Which is where "choked flow" starts and the TB model actually starts to work. All torque control via DD and TTL below that.
you can modify the inverse relationship of the Torque To Load model. Make your DD request a lower desired air load staying below the engine displacement 0.0017 lb. Then make that lower desired air load translate to a higher engine brake torque. More disabling feedback loops and even torque IPC stuff is need doing this.
you can tell it the cylinders are filling with more air mass than they normally would be with just barometric pressure (refer to engine displacement thats 0.0017 lb again) via aircharge multiplier, which they are because its being forced in there with the pressure build up from the FI device. Then correct the MAP max vs airmass(less than engine displacement airmass, that produce higher than barometric pressure MAP) for the partial throttle boosted areas. The throttle blade angle controls cylinder airmass at all times.

Theres even probably other ways to get the computer to have your pedal input do what you want the engine to do. Throttle angle error can get thrown into a lot of graphs and tables, or just ignored if thats what you prefer.


"tweaks to the tune at the track"
This is very simple WOT stuff like target WOT lambda. Target final spark. Shift points for each gear.... What is being discussed is partial throttle everyday driving stuff.
Buy some axels, drive shaft, wide 28" tall slicks, and get it to leave off the Tbrake playing with the fuel and spark on the launch. You'll learn pretty quick.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 1810R80

Murfie,

How much should the aircharge multiplier be increased? Should the maximum load under SD also be increased?

I looked at a stock tune for a 2020 GT500 and the aircharge multiplier is 1 for a lot of the mapped points. Really interesting.

Thank you!

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Hi. Know it?s an old post but I was reading you guys? conversation and noticed you mentioned a gt500 stock file. You wouldn?t by any chance still happen to have that would you if so would you mind sharing it?

480 ft lb torque calculation on a whipple supercharged coyote should tell you something isn't right.

You've also got huge IPC wheel torque errors which is another indication of an issue.

Engine Brake Torque is critical and it should ideally closely match the real output of the engine.

You're also missing some critical parameters on your log. Desired Load, Desired Airmass to name a few.

10R80 applies line pressure based on input torque. If you have an engine making 600+ ft lbs but the calibration is only calculating 470 or so - you have a recipe for a burnt up transmission.