Copperhead timing table strategy

[Bill@HPTuners]

So last night I went to the track for the first time with my 2014 GT, was pleased with the results but I definitely thought I was having issues out of the hole. Traction control/Advanced trac were both turned off and I was brake stalling to 1500 before flatfooting it. This is an A6 car w/ 3.15 gears, stock converter.

On street tires the best I could muster was a 2.01 60' which I wouldn't consider terrible but I was surprised I wasn't spinning off the line all things considered.

After reviewing the logs I see that I am lacking some timing out of the hole and suspect this is part of the reason why, notice at 44:253 in the log I can definitely feel the power coming on. This all leads me into my question how is everyone handling the multiple timing tables, are you just setting them all to the same values? There are parts particularly in 1st gear where it is pulling from virtually all of them at any given point.

If you have any other tips/theories as to why the soft launch I'm all ears. I won't be back at the track until after I install a supercharger so I'll need to relearn the car anyway but I'm curious as to everyones thoughts.

Ultimately I didn't think the car would run a decent number because I could feel this soft launch just driving around, it ended up running a 12.5@113 so the power is there, just not much out of the hole.

[15PSI]

Bill - PM me. I have a tried and true calibration for a 2014 M6 car. The spark is more aggressive than yours on all mapped points. I don't want to share this openly, but I will forward it to you so you can see the differences. This calibration was done on a dyno with 93 octane fuel and is pretty much spot on (except for the tranny differences of course). Please don't share it.

[murfie]

I think most people are making it go to OP sooner, Like 50% load, you have it at 80%. Then just tuning that borderline table 1000-2500 and .55-.75 area.


If you are worried about messing up the cam timing by going into OP too soon you just need to look at the best fuel economy array and distance tables to see what MPs you need to touch. 5,6, and 7 would be the primary tables according to your tune. Don't have to worry about drivability as you have the min load for that mode higher than you will reach. coolant temps will be higher than emissions reduction tables, stability only comes into play in the higher RPMS or if you are hitting some torque limit/ traction control.

NON OP.PNG

[dbb2797]

It looks look like you may be getting tipin right at the launch too. I see the timing drop right off at the launch and your spark source goes to tipin. Could you also log torque source?

[15PSI]

Bill - The tune I have addresses many of these issues brought up by other members. There are many differences between your tune and the one I have. Murfie's suggestion is a good one. It has been modded as well in my calibration for the 2014.

[murfie]

I personally like knowing my cams will vary with load and not just RPM. You can be missing out on a lot of low end torque by using only OP cam timing to make dealing with the spark easier. More control over torque with cam timing than spark IMO.

[Bill@HPTuners]

Bill - The tune I have addresses many of these issues brought up by other members. There are many differences between your tune and the one I have. Murfie's suggestion is a good one. It has been modded as well in my calibration for the 2014.

Be happy to take a look. You can send it to bill@hptuners dot com

[Bill@HPTuners]

It looks look like you may be getting tipin right at the launch too. I see the timing drop right off at the launch and your spark source goes to tipin. Could you also log torque source?

I'll add it next time I'm fiddling around. New laptop forgot to load my previous channels file so I had to just add as many things as I remembered I wanted as quickly as I could while I was in the lane lol. Semi unprepared, yeah, that was me.

[Bill@HPTuners]

I think most people are making it go to OP sooner, Like 50% load, you have it at 80%. Then just tuning that borderline table 1000-2500 and .55-.75 area.

Thank you, yeah those tables are still set to the stock values

[15PSI]

Bill - I just sent it. As well, note the VCT differences compared to yours. The 2014 Mustang that uses this calibration has great driveability and has run high 11s with this tune (on DRs with a 1.58 60'). I think you will like the performance gains on your car.

[Bill@HPTuners]

Thanks, taking a look now.

[Bill@HPTuners]

Bill - I just sent it. As well, note the VCT differences compared to yours. The 2014 Mustang that uses this calibration has great driveability and has run high 11s with this tune (on DRs with a 1.58 60'). I think you will like the performance gains on your car.

So the big difference here is manual vs auto. Manual can just raise his launch rpm over any low rpm dead spots which is what I'm seeing. Not saying I couldn't use some of the info but there are so many differences even from ford between M6 & A6 its really hard to extract what would work and what wouldn't. Either way I appreciate all the help everyone has given thus far. Hopefully I'll get it figured out as I have no plans to add a higher stall converter at this time to "work around" the issue.

[murfie]

Here's a graph layout you can use to see what MP your borderline spark is low at launch. Just pay attention to your spark source to make sure its borderline and not a limit.

Bill layout.PNG

[Bill@HPTuners]

I'm curious to hear specifically from stock stall auto guys if this is typical. I'm sure I can work out the timing but if that doesn't turn out to be the answer I'm not sure what I should be modifying. Ultimately I'll be installing a centrifugal blower which won't build much boost at the line so I'd hate to be in the same position at that time. Maybe they just don't make shit for tq down below 2000 rpms but I'm still hopeful it's just an issue with the guy behind the keyboard.

[luisdavid11]

might want to adjust your cylinder pressure limit spark table. its hitting that limit a few times in the log

[Thatwhite5.0]

What I do, since the weight will not always stay in OP. I?ll do a few runs to get some good timing for OP in both Borderline and MBT. I?ll take my OP borderline and MBT, and I?ll copy from 3000 to 7000rpm/.75 to 1.1 load and paste it to all the MP. You can also take your borderline, copy it to MBT and +4. I also have my spark advance limit to only allow up to 4 degrees.
spark_mbt_blk.JPG

You had a 1500 RPM launch. Not sure what rpm you?ll spin on stock converter, if you could bring it up more to get your launch load a little higher. You can get it right into OP at around 2000 or 2500 RPM right after launch. Then you?ll need to adjust timing at those ranges. Add more MBT and see how much timing the car adds. Below .75 will be stock, above .75 will be your timing.
The distance tables are good to adjust also as Murphy said. They take out any delay or over shooting. My intake cams would have to take the time to advance from 0 to 50* and the exhaust would usually have to advance also because it would be 40* retarded, and I?d need closer to 20*. Usually they're not perfect. My exhaust cam will sometimes retard 10* more from the speed of revving until I changed the distance tables.

distance_op-enable.JPG
limits.JPG
vct.JPG