Increased HP or Driveability

[mr08353]

A general question as I am new to tuning. It's a very easy one for anybody who is an experienced tuner and one that I know has been asked before. Pretty sure I can't be the first one to ask this question.
Is there a method of tuning that would serve to obtain the greatest HP from the engine and a separate method to achieve great driveability at the expense of losing HP.
Ex. After the dyno tune, all the numbers are looking right on the scan file and where they should be at and the car drives great, but the HP was 15-20 less than what it should have been. So is it possible to tune the engine to achieve more HP, at the expense of driveability? Make sense?

[5FDP]

Sure, you could tune the vehicle for just WOT, that's easy enough and then have it drive like shit everywhere else. Seen many tunes on here that have been that way.

With HP Tuners it's pretty much always possible to have both power and driveability. That is the only way to try and tune something in my eyes, you want to be able to drive it everyday and have the power on demand when you need it.

[mr08353]

Makes sense Sir. Thank you for the reply. Kinda thought that was the case but I've heard a lot of info that contradicts both sides.

[Spence]

Sure, you could tune the vehicle for just WOT, that's easy enough and then have it drive like shit everywhere else. Seen many tunes on here that have been that way.

With HP Tuners it's pretty much always possible to have both power and driveability. That is the only way to try and tune something in my eyes, you want to be able to drive it everyday and have the power on demand when you need it.

Spot on. Pretty much what I would say as well.

[mr08353]

Spot on. Pretty much what I would say as well.

Good deal. So is there any reason why you couldn't have 2 different tunes?
One for driving around town and a separate on for WOT HP for Friday night at the strip?

[5FDP]

You could but it's pointless to me unless one tune was strictly for like NOS or race gas and you wanted to run way more timing.


Making one tune for everything (excluding NOS/race fuel) is the way to go. These computers have a huge range of capability. Making them run like a normal car in stop and go traffic, around town, on the freeway for MPG and for running WOT can all be on the same tune. It's how they come from the factory, they are able to do everything.


Running a seperate tune has it's place for sure depending on what exactly you are going for but there is no need for 2 if you aren't adding anything extra to the situation.

[dermotw]

I might add... emissions.. Making it work well AND have acceptable emissions wasn't so easy for me, but it was possible in the end, just about.

But probably I'll end up with an emissions tune that I load once a year to take to be tested (I'm not in the USA)....

[schpenxel]

Unless you're running nitrous or something along those lines then this makes no sense. Making more power doesn't mean it drives like crap. Quite the opposite actually.

It isn't like we're switching from a mild cam to a huge cam by pressing some buttons.

You want everything to work the best it can with the hardware you have. One tune can (and should) do that at low and high RPM's/loads.

[mr08353]

Unless you're running nitrous or something along those lines then this makes no sense. Making more power doesn't mean it drives like crap. Quite the opposite actually.

It isn't like we're switching from a mild cam to a huge cam by pressing some buttons.

You want everything to work the best it can with the hardware you have. One tune can (and should) do that at low and high RPM's/loads.

There's the rub - in your statement "everything to work the best it can". Is there a standard for everything working right and "the best it can"? If so, what is it? If you visit with one tuner, he says he knows all the buttons to push to get to 100% efficiency. Another tuner may look at the same tune and claim that it's all jacked up and HE knows a better way. So where's the standard for a perfect tune to make the engine use every bit of the hardware to the maximum efficiency?

[schpenxel]

Nothing is that black and white. And every tuner says their stuff don't stink, it is what it is. Bottom line it's spark and fuel, not rocket science

[mr08353]

Nothing is that black and white. And every tuner says their stuff don't stink, it is what it is. Bottom line it's spark and fuel, not rocket science

Lol. Somebody that wasn't afraid to sift through the pile. Thank you Sir.

[gmtech16450yz]

IMHO, at least 8 out of 10 "tuners" don't have a clue how to tune driveability. So of course if any of those 8 "tuners" looked at each other's tunes, they'd say they suck. Most likely because they do.

WOT tuning is pretty brainless. I could teach damn near anyone how to do it in an hour lesson. All the rest is extremely difficult and can't be done in the short amount of time most tuners want to spend on actual street driving/logging. And yes, you absolutely can have maximum power AND perfect street manners. With things like electric throttles there is nothing you can't do with proper tuning.

[mr08353]

IMHO, at least 8 out of 10 "tuners" don't have a clue how to tune driveability. So of course if any of those 8 "tuners" looked at each other's tunes, they'd say they suck. Most likely because they do.

WOT tuning is pretty brainless. I could teach damn near anyone how to do it in an hour lesson. All the rest is extremely difficult and can't be done in the short amount of time most tuners want to spend on actual street driving/logging. And yes, you absolutely can have maximum power AND perfect street manners. With things like electric throttles there is nothing you can't do with proper tuning.

OK so if WOT tuning for max HP without "tearing stuff up" is brainless, why isn't it being done? But maybe it is. It's like if there was the best way to do it, everybody would know...if it wasn't a secret. That's what it seems like sometimes. If somebody has found the "magic potion", they keep it to themselves. Lol. Kinda how we do everything else in life isn't it?

[jtrosky]

From my experience, what is the "best way" to tune a car is highly dependent on what the car owner is looking for. And even then, tuning is almost like an art form - there are multiple ways to accomplish the same thing (or almost the same thing). In my opinion, tuning a car is really not as "cut and dry" as it would seem. Plus, every car is a little different (even if it's the same "model"). Add to that weather differences, gas quality differences, driver preference differences, etc - and there are a ton of "combinations" to consider when tuning. What would seem to be a "perfect" tune on one car, for one specific person, in one region of the country - might be horrible for another driver living in a different climate with different gas quality.

There are just a LOT of variables.

Some people like the transmission shifts to be "firm" and others (like myself), like smooth, seamless shifts that you can't even feel. I've tried 2 different "performance" tunes and disliked them both - but others rave about them. Everyone is different and has different goals and preferences.

While tuning for "max HP" may be somewhat easy to do (when you know what you're doing), it's all of the other details related to "driveability" that are hard to "master". I've been trying to tune my car for about a year now - and still don't have it "just right". Of course, I am learning as I go, so that makes it go a lot slower, but even if I knew what I was doing, there are just so many variables that even when you think you got it "just right", a drive a week later reveals a new issue.

My point is that there are tons of variables and every car is just a little different. So the "perfect" tune will be different per person, per car, per location. :-)