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Thread: 2 Bar Speed Density Wanting WAY too Much Fuel Problem

  1. #1
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    2 Bar Speed Density Wanting WAY too Much Fuel Problem

    I've got another one that I've wasted way too much time and fuel on. After having to "tweak" the idle on this thing - requiring a VE redial, I decided to convert it over to a 2 bar OS to keep from having to put up with the virtual ve and to have a more detailed fuel control. I know there was a post with an almost identical problem a few weeks back in regards to what I've got going on, but I can not find it. I'm sure it's something stupid that I didn't click on when I did the OS conversion, but not sure since SO much changed in how this things behaving. Plus I've never had this problem before doing the OS conversion this way.

    What I've got going on is when getting into boost, my fueling begins to lean out to the point where I abort. Every time it wants 30% more fuel and I've just about maxed out my VE table in this area. The VE table is completely different now from what it was. Before it was almost spot on to what was being commanded with boost. It's already almost double what it was. This is only with 8psi of boost too. I would say that something is wrong with the car, but this started immediately after the 2 bar os install. Never the less I will be checking fuel pressure Monday just to rule it out. I've also had problems with open loop fueling being way off since doing the conversion, but fixed that with a slight increase in my OL injector temp and intake valve temp multipliers. Since they are both OL issues, thinking it might just be the same problem...

    I've attached the tune, datalog config and the lean spike issue while making a pull. This was right after flashing, so it had the pain in my arse "rich after flash" issue for those looking at the fuel trims at the beginning and scratching your heads. You can see the trims at the end settle down to where they're supposed to be. Thought about that causing an issue, but it never has before and even with the -3 fuel being pulled, it's not enough to throw the fueling out 30+%...

    Sorry for the long winded post. Here's the datalog...

    Thanks for any and all help.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    2010 Vette Stock Bottom LS3 - LS2 APS Twin Turbo Kit, Trick Flow Heads and Custom Cam - 12psi - 714rwhp and 820rwtq / 100hp Nitrous Shot starting at 3000 rpms - 948rwhp and 1044rwtq still on 93
    2011 Vette Cam Only Internal Mod in stock LS3 -- YSI @ 18psi - 811rwhp on 93 / 926rwhp on E60 & 1008rwhp with a 50 shot of nitrous all through a 6L80

    ~Greg Huggins~
    Remote Tuning Available at gh[email protected]
    Mobile Tuning Available for North Georgia and WNC

  2. #2
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    Look at the injector duty cycle.... Seems a little high !!!
    2007 Corvette C6 Vert. A6
    LME LS402, Pat G custom cam, ATI 10% OD Damper
    Circle D triple disc 2600, 3.42 Diff
    YSI, 3.0 pulley, ID 1000's
    Alky Control Meth,
    ARH 1 7/8 headers,
    1009 RWHP @ 7000, 817 RWT @ 6000

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by realcanuk View Post
    Look at the injector duty cycle.... Seems a little high !!!
    Well, if I hadn't forgotten to reinstall injector duty cycle into my scanner config when I changed it, I might very well had been able to see that. This is why it always pays to have a second set of eyes on a problem... I'm pretty sure I know what I did to cause the problem now. I'll check into it first thing Monday Morning. Otherwise the cheapo boost a pump has caused fuel pump issues and that's my problem. It's either one or the other at this point. The issue in the tune would best explain my cold start OL being so far off along with my OL WOT issue. This would correspond to both...

    Thank you very much...

    Curious, what is the duty cycle in that scan?

    Thanks Again,
    Greg
    2010 Vette Stock Bottom LS3 - LS2 APS Twin Turbo Kit, Trick Flow Heads and Custom Cam - 12psi - 714rwhp and 820rwtq / 100hp Nitrous Shot starting at 3000 rpms - 948rwhp and 1044rwtq still on 93
    2011 Vette Cam Only Internal Mod in stock LS3 -- YSI @ 18psi - 811rwhp on 93 / 926rwhp on E60 & 1008rwhp with a 50 shot of nitrous all through a 6L80

    ~Greg Huggins~
    Remote Tuning Available at gh[email protected]
    Mobile Tuning Available for North Georgia and WNC

  4. #4
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    I'm not at my computer right now but if remember right it goes to 127%.

  5. #5
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    Well although injection timing being moved in the correct direction did help tremendously, it was not my problem. Apparently when pricing out fuel pumps - I was told I'm just making too much power for my stock fuel pump. Anything over 600hp to the rear wheels on a c6 needs lots a fuel. That was what they told me anyway after I checked my fuel pressure and she was dropping to below 30psi with throttle. Also noticed today "when the problem wasn't present", that my idle fuelng would go from +/-2% to "problem being present" and a +24 ltft and running at a 18AirFuel Explains why I've been having so many problems dialing this bastard in. Plus today it had really really long cranks after the pump started to let go.

    Hope that post wasn't too misworded... Anyway pumps on it's way and just thought I would post my follow up. Now I really feel like an idiot not catching this sooner.
    2010 Vette Stock Bottom LS3 - LS2 APS Twin Turbo Kit, Trick Flow Heads and Custom Cam - 12psi - 714rwhp and 820rwtq / 100hp Nitrous Shot starting at 3000 rpms - 948rwhp and 1044rwtq still on 93
    2011 Vette Cam Only Internal Mod in stock LS3 -- YSI @ 18psi - 811rwhp on 93 / 926rwhp on E60 & 1008rwhp with a 50 shot of nitrous all through a 6L80

    ~Greg Huggins~
    Remote Tuning Available at gh[email protected]
    Mobile Tuning Available for North Georgia and WNC

  6. #6
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    Lol, welcome to the club. I've definitely put in hours trying to tune around what ended up being a fuel supply problem.

  7. #7
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    Yes, it was really starting to tick me off "being sensitive with what I'm saying of course"... Come to think of it with as many times as I've had to change the fueling on this, I was beginning to wonder just how long this has been going on. Waiting on the new pump right now. Thinking with the high flow of this new one, I might just get rid of the boost a pump.
    2010 Vette Stock Bottom LS3 - LS2 APS Twin Turbo Kit, Trick Flow Heads and Custom Cam - 12psi - 714rwhp and 820rwtq / 100hp Nitrous Shot starting at 3000 rpms - 948rwhp and 1044rwtq still on 93
    2011 Vette Cam Only Internal Mod in stock LS3 -- YSI @ 18psi - 811rwhp on 93 / 926rwhp on E60 & 1008rwhp with a 50 shot of nitrous all through a 6L80

    ~Greg Huggins~
    Remote Tuning Available at gh[email protected]
    Mobile Tuning Available for North Georgia and WNC

  8. #8
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    injector_cycle.png

    Duty cycle 147%... may need some new injectors !

  9. #9
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    Injectors were fine unless they've suddenly become stopped up. More than capable of supplying fuel when I tuned this thing the first time around. In fact right now "when the pump was working - currently it won't hardly even start due to the low fuel pressure" it's running PIG rich "pegs out and continues below 10.3 on dyno" until about 4000 rpms when my fuel pressure dropped below 30psi in the above pull and she went super lean. After the first tune, before I went in to correct a few little nit picky things she put down 637hp and 681tq to the rear wheels. BUT ever since then she's been steadily going down hill according to the owner "and myself from what I felt when I drove it again", which is why she went back to the dyno, where the obvious problem showed it's ugly head

    Really sucks to have been a very good driveability tech for so many years, figuring out what others couldn't and then having something like this kick my butt

    147% duty cycle... Now that's amazing.
    2010 Vette Stock Bottom LS3 - LS2 APS Twin Turbo Kit, Trick Flow Heads and Custom Cam - 12psi - 714rwhp and 820rwtq / 100hp Nitrous Shot starting at 3000 rpms - 948rwhp and 1044rwtq still on 93
    2011 Vette Cam Only Internal Mod in stock LS3 -- YSI @ 18psi - 811rwhp on 93 / 926rwhp on E60 & 1008rwhp with a 50 shot of nitrous all through a 6L80

    ~Greg Huggins~
    Remote Tuning Available at gh[email protected]
    Mobile Tuning Available for North Georgia and WNC