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Thread: Maxing LNF Fuel System Out

  1. #1
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    Maxing LNF Fuel System Out

    When scanning the car with HPT. What should I log to look at the fuel system to know if I am going to max out fuel? Like on port injection you can look at Injector Duty % for at least to let you know where you are at on the injector side of it. And what has been the normal power when running into maxing the stock fuel system out?
    Thank you.

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    Msec above 7, or fuel pressure dropping on the hit. Stock turbo will not max it on pump gas, or race gas. E85 is limited to 22psi on stock turbo.
    The most hated, make the most power.
    93 Ranger. 5.3 D1X. 1069hp.

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    Alright, I am on update turbo. Borg Warner T04E(P/N 171443). Also forged bottom end. Stock cylinder head with upgraded valve springs, stock camshafts, and stock fuel system. What should be my next upgrade for the fuel, Camshafts with larger Fuel Lobe or the Opel Injectors that ZZP offer or the higher output High Pressure Fuel Pump from ZZP or a 5th Injector Setup? I would like to switch over to E85. So I can make more power on 25psi.

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    This.












    E47. Stock cam. Stock injectors. Stock HPFP and LPFP. Bump the high and low side fuel pressure up. Done. Beyond that you're just spending money and risking reliability.

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    WOW! That is awesome. Who designed that? What are you using to control that injector and also what size injector is that? That is a very nicely designed setup. I want to do it. You talked me into it.

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    Mark,

    Did you have a custom manifold or adapter built for the turbo or did you use the stock turbine housing and make a hybrid turbo setup?

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    It is ZZP turbo manifold with external wastegate. And it is a hybrid with stock turbine housing.

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    What is max power that people have been getting out of stock turbos? Engine hp or wheel hp? Just wanting to compare to my setup.

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    Cobaltss.net forum has a thread that keeps a list of top dyno numbers both stock turbo and aftermarket. Don't remember the numbers or thread name though.
    Edit: found this: http://www.cobaltss.net/forums/dyno-results-170/official-dyno-thread-2013-a-304260/
    Last edited by TurboCobalt; 12-19-2014 at 08:25 PM.

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    Mark, GMTech did that set up himself, and it has been copied since. If you would like to DIY then you could look on DIY Autotune's site to get a bung like that. Then to control it, look into the split second controllers. Seems to be the best way I have found to do it, looks like I will be in it less than $350 with the bung, injector, controller, and injector wiring. You'll easily double that buying this set up from other vendors, and the ZZP style, though it works, leaves some performance on the table due to how it is set up.

    As for power, you have a Delta or Kappa?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mkriebs View Post
    Mark, GMTech did that set up himself, and it has been copied since. If you would like to DIY then you could look on DIY Autotune's site to get a bung like that. Then to control it, look into the split second controllers. Seems to be the best way I have found to do it, looks like I will be in it less than $350 with the bung, injector, controller, and injector wiring. You'll easily double that buying this set up from other vendors, and the ZZP style, though it works, leaves some performance on the table due to how it is set up.

    As for power, you have a Delta or Kappa?
    Yeah, copied by my friendly lying, cheating, law breaking, thieving vendor that has also "copied" (stolen) my tunes, adjustable clutch setup, EFR build setup, etc, etc, etc. I'm not bitter though, I feel sorry for him considering the sh!tstorm of horrifically bad Karma that guy has coming to him.


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    Quote Originally Posted by gmtech16450yz View Post
    Yeah, copied by my friendly lying, cheating, law breaking, thieving vendor that has also "copied" (stolen) my tunes, adjustable clutch setup, EFR build setup, etc, etc, etc. I'm not bitter though, I feel sorry for him considering the sh!tstorm of horrifically bad Karma that guy has coming to him.
    GOD DAMNIT! i sent them a killer lsj base file for a tvs car to get the car going so he could bring it to KC.

    shit shit shit...

    p.s. i couldn't view the photo at work.. hence this big ass edit.
    Last edited by Area47; 01-16-2015 at 02:40 PM.
    The most hated, make the most power.
    93 Ranger. 5.3 D1X. 1069hp.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gmtech16450yz View Post
    Yeah, copied by my friendly lying, cheating, law breaking, thieving vendor that has also "copied" (stolen) my tunes, adjustable clutch setup, EFR build setup, etc, etc, etc. I'm not bitter though, I feel sorry for him considering the sh!tstorm of horrifically bad Karma that guy has coming to him.

    [IMG]http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz337/j16450yz/IMG_2497.jpg[IMG]
    Ouch. I'm pretty sure mkreibs used to work there and do the tuning.

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    Sorry to hear about all the issues with it. But let be most likely not the first one to say it but one heck of a job on the setup! Really awesome job!

  15. #15
    Fact is gmtech is a huge reason why the LNF tuning has gotten anywhere. He is very friendly, easy to talk to, extremely intelligent and insanely skilled. The whole reason there is an attitude of helping others to learn but not posting and sharing is because his stuff was stolen by "pro" tuning shops.

    He is the reason I learned everything so quickly. It's a shame but you'll always get lazy and dishonest people stealing others' hard work and claiming as their own for profit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by codename Bil Doe View Post
    Fact is gmtech is a huge reason why the LNF tuning has gotten anywhere. He is very friendly, easy to talk to, extremely intelligent and insanely skilled. The whole reason there is an attitude of helping others to learn but not posting and sharing is because his stuff was stolen by "pro" tuning shops.

    He is the reason I learned everything so quickly. It's a shame but you'll always get lazy and dishonest people stealing others' hard work and claiming as their own for profit.

    Geeeez dude, what are you trying to do, make me cry? Or are you just trying to get a ride in my car? lol. I'll do one better than that. The next time we meet up at a C&C or something, YOU can drive my car.

    Seriously, that was one of the nicest things anyone has said about me online. Thanks a ton Bill, I do really appreciate it. I've always felt that this has been a little more than just a forum community here, it's almost more like a team working together for a common goal. I carried the torch for awhile there, and a bunch of you guys took it and ran with it. I've been SO impressed that the handful of guys like you have stayed active here, keeping an eye out for others in need of guidance or direction. My "Learn and Share" threads back then seem a little corny and over-dramatic, but it's what I always wanted an online forum to be like. I tried SO friggin hard to make the Solstice, Sky and Kappa forums work like this, but I failed. I hate to admit it, but the demographics for our cars just sucks! It seems like 90% of them are just bitter old men or just plain ignorant retards. (Ouch! lol) I've been banned from the Solstice and Kappa Performance (that has absolutely NOTHING to do with performance) forums, and I'll never go back to the Sky forum.

    (What did he say? He's been banned from 2 forums? hahahahaha!)

    On the subject of Werks and my post above about their 5th injector setup, I'll try to keep this short and it will be the last I say about it on this forum. I really shouldn't have even posted those comments, this forum doesn't deserve that kind of cr@p and I apologize for even mentioning it. Since I did, I'll explain as succinctly as I can and won't mention it here again.

    I've been dealing with vendors of all types for over 40 years now. Never in those 40 years of dealing with hundreds, if not thousands of people, have I run across someone as dishonest as Dave Gilbert, the owner of Performance Autowerks. This is a person I once trusted and worked with, exchanging knowledge and ideas freely with. I honesty don't know if he changed, or I was just blind to who he really was. I'm usually a pretty good judge of character, it's almost like something snapped in him a few years ago. I honestly think that. I think something physical or emotional happened to turn him into what he has become lately. He is a Pathological Liar. I could give you all here dozens of examples, but again this is not the place. Let's just say he has done some insanely despicable things in the last few years to his customers, the vendors he deals with, and people like me that were once considered friends.

    For me, the tipping point was the LNF/EFR turbo exhaust manifold I worked together with Stainless Headers to create and market. I brought those two vendors, those two people who I trusted, together so that they could BOTH benefit. All I asked for from the deal was a discount on the first manifold so I could have a dependable manifold on my EFR build, since the Werks manifolds were garbage and cracked in half constantly. Long story short, (lol) They both sold a bunch of those manifolds, they were a work of art and only had ONE failure that happened to be on the Pirelli World Challenge GTS Solstice I worked on. It failed because the crew chief didn't listen to me when I BEGGED him to not wrap the manifold. The manifold was wrapped so well that it obviously overheated and cracked after TWO DAYS on the dyno. I know that because I was there in that dyno room for those two days and saw it with my own eyes. Anyway, months later I see a post on the Kappa Performance forum from Dave Gilbert saying how "Every single one of the Stainless Headers EFR turbo manifolds we sold had catastrophic failures". Holy cr@p I just about jumped out of my chair when I saw that! I IMMEDIATELY texted Dave and basically asked him to "Come clean and tell the truth" about the manifolds. He didn't. He never has. Here's the absolute truth of what happened to make Dave say those absolute lies about that manifold...

    Dave Gilbert doesn't pay his bills. I know that for a fact because I sold him a Sky Redline and it took months for me to get him to pay for it. We agreed on a price and he said he'd send me a check. Weeks went by, no check. He said he needed the car badly so I trusted him and told him to arrange shipping. The car was shipped from California to his shop in Illinois. Still no check. More weeks go by. FINALLY, after dozens of emails and phone calls, he sends me a check for the car. No big deal I figured, I wasn't freaking out or needed the money. I just put it in the back of my mind and forgot about it. So when this Stainless Headers thing happened, I gave Chris, the owner of Stainless Headers, a call about it. Well guess what? Chris got tired of Dave NOT PAYING FOR MANIFOLDS HE ORDERED AND SOLD so he put him on a "cash only" basis. Dave tried to order half a dozen manifolds and Chris told him he wouldn't ship them until Dave paid for them. Dave obviously couldn't pay for them since his company is constantly in a negative cash flow, so he tells Chris "F you" and cancels the orders. That was ONE WEEK BEFORE he started lying about the manifolds having "catastrophic failures"!!!!!!! So he orders a half a dozen of these manifolds because they're so awesome, the vendor refuses to ship them because he won't pay his bills, then a week later they're garbage and he won't sell them? He CAN'T sell them because he screwed the vendor that makes them. Like I said, I've never in my 40 years of dealing with vendors seen somebody this dishonest.

    Sorry for the "long story short". lol. I guess it's just not possible for me to make a long story short! So yeah, the 5th injector manifold deal is just one of dozens of things Dave Gilbert has stolen from me and others. He has NO talent of his own. He is now selling "tuning", but he has admitted to me many times that he KNOWS NOTHING about tuning. I fell for his idea of him being the front man selling tuning and me actually doing the work, and we'd split the fees. He started selling tunes and sending me the files to actually do the tuning. It was a disaster. Since he wouldn't let me talk directly to the customer, they ended up being totally screwed by Dave. I got paid for ONE tune. After that he simply took my tunes and copied them onto other customer's cars. Seriously, copy and paste tuning!!! I'm not kidding.

    Let me explain the banning part in as few sentences as I can. Hahahahaha yeah right.
    I tried to let my fellow forum members know what Dave was doing BEFORE he screwed more good people out of their hard earned money. Dave contacted the owner of the Kappa Performance forum and HAD ME BANNED!!!! Again, I couldn't make this chit up if I tried! I got that straight from the forum owner myself, he admitted it to me when I pressed him on why I was banned. I spoke up, Dave was a friend of his and asked to shut me up, and he did. What a wonderful world huh?

    That's it, I've said enough. I'm sorry Mark for messing up your thread with this. A couple of you asked questions, and Matt Kriebs was brought into it a little bit too. Matt was at Werks before I started working with Dave, and a little during I believe. I have NO issues with Matt whatsoever, he seems like a standup guy. I have dealt with the Matt that's working with Dave at Werks right now, I'm not sure people realize those are two different Matt's. I'm not going to comment on what I think about the Matt that works with Dave now. This was all about Dave and the lying, cheating, dishonest, illegal and just plain immoral way he's been conducting himself in the last couple years. I've mentioned illegal twice now so I'll explain. It is ILLEGAL to charge someone's credit card BEFORE shipping that customer's product. That's SOP for Performance Autowerks. They charge your card as soon as they get off the phone with you. Just ONE example is charging ~18 guys credit cards for sway bars that hadn't even been made by the outside vendor yet! Some of those guys didn't get their bars FOR OVER A YEAR!!! Approximately $3500 worth of credit card charges without the product even being in existence for MONTHS. That's illegal.

    Sorry again to clutter this thread up! Can you guys tell I needed to vent a little bit? lol. I tried to forget about this cr@p but I recently saw that picture of an intake manifold with a 5th injector that look eerily similar to my design! Whatever. He'll get what he deserves in the end. We all do.

  17. #17
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    gmtech: thats a badass manifold dude! did you see any problem with spraying against incoming air or did that help dispersion in your mind? the one i welded bungs for had injectors laying down at a minor angle spraying each port from the front. i never finished it though as i saw everyone else doing it way cheaper like your setup.
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

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    Re: Werks and myself...
    I am no longer affiliated with the shop, I am off doing my own thing. I do appreciate things that I have learned through working at the shop, it opened my eyes to the perils of customer service. I did some of the LNF and LSJ tuning there for approximately one year and helped develop the PTE 5557 Cobalt kit. I left on good terms and will not speak out of turn on the subject on hand. I will say this regarding John, he is a straight shooter, he is very smart, and extremely nice and willing to share his knowledge, which I am very appreciative of. I aspire to take on the mentality that John has, do my own thing, make it right, make some cool stuff and enjoy life.

    Working at the shop, I found myself getting wrapped up in the who's who of the LNF game, looking over good people because they went to "that shop" to have their car worked on, it was just not a good mentality to have. Now I speak my piece, learn where I can, and have a good time. Thanks to John for that.