the car will never run right in open loop,, IT suppose to go into closed loop
i didn't change any of that stuff and even with the cam mine stays from 14.0-15.5 at all times
i think you just start over.... way to much stuff has been messed wit hfor the wrong reasons
http://www.turbov6camaro.com
1997 Stalled V6 Camaro
Goal: 10.99 in the 1/4
Goal: 100 MPH (completed)
Best Dyno: 456 RWHP and 509 RWTQ
Best: 1/4 mile 11.23 20 PSI
Best1/8: 7.18 @ 99 1.83, 60 foot 20 PSI
I dont want closed loop cause with my headers they dont read acurately..Originally Posted by slow6
I actually prefer open loop as I have seen more consistent fueling from day to day...closed loop always looks for your stoich value..and its not determined by a real AFR..its determined by a voltage that an o2 reports that is dependent on the o2 temperature..if the o2 is not seeing enough/or too much heat then it reads differently
and you get afr comanding 14.63 and o2's reading 15.2
you an actually use the 12v dc source from the o2 sensor connectors(usually teh rears cause nobody cares about rear o2's) and it turns on when you turn the key...also exhaust blows off any condensation before teh sensor is hot and teh sensor warms up properly at the same time
-Scott -
most vehicles run better in open loop if you tune it properly...
and 14.0~15.5!!!! I see 14.5~14.8 consistently from day to day in open loop..
one of the issues you v6 guys have is that you have a MAF that is 100% in control..which can be good...and bad...part throttle transients really arent accurate at all..and idle goes way south with MAF as idle reversion air is an issue with cams.
I dont have a stock v6 file to look at but it all looks pretty normal to me so far in that tune..
that PE base enrichment table could use a lot richer as most power is 12.5~13.0 ish
and if you do FI then your adder tables vs time can be extremeely useful especially when you run out of KPA at 140 and RPM at 6400...
-Scott -
also I dont undrstand why you are logging 36 pids and 6 status bits..try logging less stuff and get a faster frame rate
I also dont see a wideband happening in that log...so how do you know your AFR....
commanded AFR is one thing..LTFT's and STFT always try to get your AFR to what is commanded...
+LTFT's dont mean lean..they just mean that the tables dont command enough fuel and the PCM has corrected for it..
-Scott -
our v6's runs aout of map at 105... just FYI
14.0 is not bad when its comanding 14.7.... same with 15.5, i KNOW 100% i have exuast leaks before the WBO2 so those numbers are not bad at all
http://www.turbov6camaro.com
1997 Stalled V6 Camaro
Goal: 10.99 in the 1/4
Goal: 100 MPH (completed)
Best Dyno: 456 RWHP and 509 RWTQ
Best: 1/4 mile 11.23 20 PSI
Best1/8: 7.18 @ 99 1.83, 60 foot 20 PSI
you mustve misread it its actually 14.5:1...dude your going to blow up your motor.i'm no pro tuner, but what the hell did you do to that tune, the spark looks okay
Why would you not want close loop
why are you only commanding a 13.5 AFR with no RPM adder? i understand it makes it a bit less hard to tune but at 5700 RPM you going to need to add fuel (more air )
yes you need the EIO to log the WBO2
the AEM WBO@ has biult in heater... you don't have to wait 20seconds to start the car.... turn key let pump prime and start the car....
It doesn't have to be perfect, it just needs to be done in two weeks...
A wise man once said "google it"
from the factory the car while in closed loop for the most part will command 14.7 and usually do pretty well in keeping it there...dfco is a whole nother issue though.
It doesn't have to be perfect, it just needs to be done in two weeks...
A wise man once said "google it"
Why would you not want close loopsorry, I misunderstood
I am in open loop until 68F (stock) then closed.
soundengineer wanted me to stay in open for this reason:
I dont have EIO yet
yeah...
what I'm pushing for is fo ryou to be in open loop so you can use a wideband to get A/F readings...and using AFR error % [100*((AFR-Commanded AFR)/commanded AFR)]
you can then use that table to multiply by % and do it a few times to really dial it in....
then your MAF curve will be correct and you can go back into closed loop
this should net you teh best results as your MAF table will be commanding the right amount of fuel to begin with....any trimming is then indication that your o2's need adjustment..possibly different switchpoints...possibly just need new o2's or different o2's
-Scott -
and since you dont have EIO...you cnat do any of that and should wait to make sure you have a way to see AF with all teh data you log.....
you can always wire the wideband 0-5v output to something like the EGR wires and just not worry about egr.leave it disconnected.... and just log EGR voltage and make a custom PID to convert it to A/F
5volts/afr range of wideband + minimum AFR
it will get you an afr you can log..and you can use an excel sheet to do AFR error...
I think I have one on my site at
www.audiohelix.com/file
should be an excell sheet for AFR error in there somewhere
Last edited by S2H; 02-04-2006 at 06:47 PM.
-Scott -
sry, that link doesnt work
so, should I turn PE off when I'm doing this Open loop maf-correction logging?
PE=100%?
My AEM has a way to hook it up to an RS 232 serial cable so you can log real AFR in HyperTerminal, or any kind of terminal telnet type program....
The only problem is how can I compare the HPT scan & the telnet program.
I need something that timestamps.
I should just order the EIO.
SoundEngineer
Mitchell
'04 Supercharged MC SS
MOD LIST
Custom PCM, Ram Air Hood w/ Air box, Intense MPS w/3.6", R/T DP with Ubend delete & HF CAT, LC-1 WB, GMPP Cat Back, Jacobs wires, 180 T-stat, & an Optima Red Top
lol..sorry...typo...corrected now
-Scott -
do you know which of the 4 EGR wires I should tap into with my 0-5v WB?
I guess it doesnt matter?
I should do a sticky writeup on how to calibrate the MAF, etc.
on custom PID:
the sensor: should be set at "exhaust gas temperature" ?
the AFR range of my AEM wideband is 10.0:1 - 18.5:1
I dont know what I should use for my minimum afr?
you will have to build a pid that basically says
([pid.2811]/(5/8.5))+10
pid 2811 should be egr voltage....need to figure out for sure what it is on a v6....
-Scott -
you are right!! 2811 is egr position #2, 2810 is "egr position #1" so I'm thinking #1 is like %, and #2 might be voltage or vice versa.
It asks for which sensor to use?
I'm not sure which of the 4 EGR wires to tap into, it probably doesnt matter?
This is just a TEMPORARY FIX until I get my EIO.
you dont have to specify a sensor...but I would just specify Air Fuel Ratio..LOL..just be sure to specify AFR as the units of measure as well
-Scott -
from the diagram I have
it looks like you need the brown for egr pintle position and black for the ground...
http://www.audiohelix.com/hptuners/s...g.diagrams.pdf
pages 16-19 in the PDF
Last edited by S2H; 02-07-2006 at 09:13 PM.
-Scott -
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