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Thread: smooth idle attempt

  1. #1
    Advanced Tuner |V3nom|'s Avatar
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    smooth idle attempt

    still not perfect yet. running about 24* at idle right now but cant seem to get it to go down. any suggestions?

    first log is just the idle.

    second log is a long drive then idling at the end of the log. looks like after driving a while it settles around 12* at idle. is this normal?

    attached the tune as well.
    2008 Sky RL

  2. #2
    Pretty good, try to get it down a little at idle. How does it react to turning on the ac, putting up the windows ect...

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dayhoff35 View Post
    Pretty good, try to get it down a little at idle. How does it react to turning on the ac, putting up the windows ect...
    Wanna shed some light or advice on what effects what?

    I've been messing with this for some time, and haven't found a consistent pattern between the tables.

  4. #4
    Advanced Tuner |V3nom|'s Avatar
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    from what i remember not great lol. like i said still needs a lot of work. been so busy with work lately i havent had a chance to do anything. maybe i can give it a shot this weekend.
    2008 Sky RL

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by LNFnewb View Post
    Wanna shed some light or advice on what effects what?

    I've been messing with this for some time, and haven't found a consistent pattern between the tables.
    mostly between the airload table, a little of the optimum spark table, the spark tables, and i messed a little bit with the optimum torque table. The main part is finding a good balance between all of them. Every car is different and likes different things.

  6. #6
    im still fighting a drop in timing after initial start up i can not figure out a way to keep it from dropping off!

  7. #7
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    i bet you its apart of cold start control which we obviously do not have any tables to control initial cold start settings
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dayhoff35 View Post
    mostly between the airload table, a little of the optimum spark table, the spark tables, and i messed a little bit with the optimum torque table. The main part is finding a good balance between all of them. Every car is different and likes different things.
    I'll keep that in mind. I've been trying to find balance, but ever time I feel I'm on the right track I tried to follow the lead I think I find, and realize I still don't actually understand the balancing act as well as I should. haha

    Quote Originally Posted by Dayhoff35 View Post
    im still fighting a drop in timing after initial start up i can not figure out a way to keep it from dropping off!
    I'm having the same problem. I think cobaltsssoverbooster is right about the tables we have no control over.

    Quote Originally Posted by cobaltssoverbooster View Post
    i bet you its apart of cold start control which we obviously do not have any tables to control initial cold start settings
    Is there any word on new tables for our cars?

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by cobaltssoverbooster View Post
    i bet you its apart of cold start control which we obviously do not have any tables to control initial cold start settings
    in gmtechs screenshot he had up he didnt have any drop off, either his car really likes him or there has to be some trick lol.

  10. #10
    the main thing is your airload get your timing close to where you want it and then dial in your airload.

  11. #11
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    lol i hear ya some lnf are special and others are well special
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

  12. #12
    yeah mines a love hate relationship lol

  13. #13
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    same here
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

  14. #14
    Advanced Tuner |V3nom|'s Avatar
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    how do the opti spark tables play their role? are these generally lowered to help the idle?

    man we need more tables lol. id be happy with tables just to get the idle down perfect.
    2008 Sky RL

  15. #15
    I raised mine a bit like I said though every car is different you have to play with the values and compare logs of the differences.

  16. #16
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    its a table that models the torque output. best bet would be to select the timing you wish to run then move the table around in small increments until it either accepts that timing or just runs like a champ altogether. i had best luck making the idle cells the same value in the ignition table so it doesnt dance around as much. my car likes 16* but everyone is different.
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

  17. #17
    Yeah i increased mine at first and both cells were fairly high, i'm working on a new file though where the values are at or below 20, feel like that's the better route to go in order to keep everything running smoother. I have mine at a smooth 10* right now, but the car feels like its trying to idle to hard.

  18. #18
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    when does each table come into play? from playing around with it, I've only seen the min, min table impacts the idle, but I feel there could be something I'm missing in all of this.

  19. #19
    Iv just recently started messing with my idle again seeing as the cold season has arrived and my car hates cold starts. Iv noticed quite a few things that i dont know if you guys noticed while reading thru new and old threads!

    Starting with this one, Venom's car looks like he LOWERED Optimum Spark around idle and LOWERED DAL's significantly and this in affect made his spark timing very close to the actual Spark tables. What i also noticed on his log was a throttle angle of 1% at idle and his fuel pressure does NOT oscillate at idle... almost like what he has changed makes the ECM operate outside of idle?!

    Now with my car my DAL's are close to stock/slightly higher, but i was doing what was suggested in GMtechs thread of RAISING the Optimum Spark around all the idle areas. Im currently at 13* or so and 2% ETC with a very short timing drop at initial start. My fuel pressure oscillates at idle when warm and im not near my actual spark timing maps in idle areas.

    Dayhoff, If you look closely at GMtechs idle log he posted it actually does have the initial timing drop just his graphs are so far zoomed out you dont notice it.

    So what do i gather from this... Could be very wrong haha... If you command less DAL, ECM starts with a more closed ETC which in turn will require more ign timing to achieve the desired idle RPM, then its a mix of the optimum spark and actual timing tables that determines what idle timing you float around. OR leave DAL's alone and raise Optimum spark, in my case i started 4*idle at 6% ETC and stock opti's, raised opti's up and now im 14* idle at 2% ETC. So 2 ways to do basically the same thing! My head hurts...

    And as far as timing drops at start up, it looks like on mine that the only reason it drops is that the RPM's are above the desired so it keeps pulling timing until it gets to desired idle speed. Once at or near the target idle speed if you continue to see timing dips pay attention to the Airload, i bet its near a transition in tables like 30%. If you look at the stock Optimum spark tables there is a significant drop from 20% to 30%. When i raised the 30% cells my timing drops were less dramatic and less frequent.

    Let me know what you guys think of all that rambling, hopefully it helps us understand this more than confuses haha

  20. #20
    I attached my file of cold start with the timing dip. Notice i left the marker on the screen at 30%. On the left of it was above 30%, right is below... left side is 6* timing and it shoots up to 13* when it dropped into the 20's airload