EQ <> VE Version 4

[reubone]

Thanx for the reply's guys. im gonna give this another shot all day tomorrow

[reubone]

this helped tremendously. can the cat tool be used without a wideband?

[GHuggins]

You can use longterm or short term corrections, but you'll probably find that this takes too long, which is just one of the reasons why the A/F sensor is preferred. BUT even so I still use longterms to "fine tune" my final table, just because this will be what the vehicle will use from this point on...

[mowton]

this helped tremendously. can the cat tool be used without a wideband?

You can't safely tune WOT (Power Enrichment (PE) mode) without a wideband. LT/ST can be used for non WOT which is idle, off idle, light cruise, moderate acceleration etc. or about 85kPa MAP or less.

Ed M

[reubone]

Yeah I was thinking that wot coulnt be tuned without one. im gonna dyno tune it for wot for now. So my histogram will be setup to populate longtern/shorterm error or correction? This will be my first custom histogram setup. thanx for all your help guys I owe ya lunch or something

[mowton]

Yeah I was thinking that wot coulnt be tuned without one. im gonna dyno tune it for wot for now. So my histogram will be setup to populate longtern/shorterm error or correction? This will be my first custom histogram setup. thanx for all your help guys I owe ya lunch or something

The long term and Short term trims are added together to get to the total trim. These values are percentages so you are there. Greg Banish did a good you tube...

www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIl3OHwHoCY

1 easier approach would be to disable the LTFT and only log STFT. Then you wont have the slower updating parameter of LTFT complicating your effort. Either way works

Your logged PID will be LTFT+STFT (if you are logging both) or STFT (disable LTFT) instead of the wideband correction he speaks of.

Ed M

Ed M

[eficalibrator]

Greg has a brief tutorial on youtube on how to set up your histogram, then you can datalog longterm fuel trims or an A/F sensor error for your corrections to use on your generated VE table.

Yep, right here... I would strongly recommend doing this with wideband lambda error instead of using the stock narrowbands and trims.

[mcdonald77]

I really hope this is not a dumb question. I am always looking to learn something new. Is there a tutorial for the blue cat tool or is it EQ <> VE Version 4, thanks


OR IS THAT IT, RIGHT ABOVE ME!

[granatl]

The video shows an older version.
I think there are numerous tutorials, but let me try to give you my perspective.
In the HP Tuners VCM Editor (and you also have open the Bluecat v 4.x tool), you copy the following table data, one by one from VCM to Bluecat.
You must make sure that EACH table in the VCM Editor is showing the most precision possible.
Bluecat will prompt you, table by table once you go to Equations and then click Import. As it prompts you, got into the VCM table and click the copy button in the VCM toolbar.
Engine->Airflow->Dynamic->Zone RPM Boundaries
Engine->Airflow->Dynamic->Zone MAP Boundaries
Engine->Airflow->Speed Density -> Constant
Engine->Airflow->Speed Density -> MAP2
Engine->Airflow->Speed Density -> MAP
(etc.)
Once they are all imported, the Bluecat tool takes you back to the home screen. Click "Generate VE Tables"
Click "VE Table"
Select a table format that suits your needs. Since I run a boosted car, I tend to use a 2.5 bar style.
Also, make sure to set your Cyl(inder) displacement. I usually leave the VE% unchecked and just work with raw GMVE numbers.
Fill in every single cell. Interpolate/extrapolate works wonders, but isn't perfect. Make sure your current cell makes sense with all of its neighbors. There will be a trend that the lowest number will be in the upper-left (low MAP and low RPM) and the cells will gradually increase as you proceed down and to the right. They won't always increase though, but there will be a general trend. This is the airflow map of your engine, so there may be some "waves" in the trending. Parts of mine increase 70 GMVE units in neighboring horizontal cells, while other places even slightly decrease. I have a ripple in mine, presumably because of the turbo + cam.

Once you complete all the cells, close the table and return to the main Bluecat window.
There are numerous sliders and options at the left. I do leave "Auto Zone Boundaries" turned off and favor "precision" over "speed." Others on here can give you the best options and it will vary with your car, etc.

Click on the "Generate Equations" button. The graph of your VE Map will show red segments (zones) readjusting to fit your zone values. The graph turns black and red while working. The speed of the calculations depends on your computer speed, etc, but it only takes me about a minute to do the 2.5 bar map. The graph returns to green when done.

Click the "Equations" button and this time do "Export." Very similar concept to import, except as you go into the tables in the VCM editor, you click paste. If you're not doing "Auto Zone Boundaries" the "Zone Map Boundaries" will act like you're not actually pasting anything (no color changes). And be real careful about pasting into the correct tables!

Let me know if you want me to elaborate.

[8850]

The video shows an older version.
I think there are numerous tutorials, but let me try to give you my perspective.
In the HP Tuners VCM Editor (and you also have open the Bluecat v 4.x tool), you copy the following table data, one by one from VCM to Bluecat.
You must make sure that EACH table in the VCM Editor is showing the most precision possible.
Bluecat will prompt you, table by table once you go to Equations and then click Import. As it prompts you, got into the VCM table and click the copy button in the VCM toolbar.
Engine->Airflow->Dynamic->Zone RPM Boundaries
Engine->Airflow->Dynamic->Zone MAP Boundaries
Engine->Airflow->Speed Density -> Constant
Engine->Airflow->Speed Density -> MAP2
Engine->Airflow->Speed Density -> MAP
(etc.)
Once they are all imported, the Bluecat tool takes you back to the home screen. Click "Generate VE Tables"
Click "VE Table"
Select a table format that suits your needs. Since I run a boosted car, I tend to use a 2.5 bar style.
Also, make sure to set your Cyl(inder) displacement. I usually leave the VE% unchecked and just work with raw GMVE numbers.
Fill in every single cell. Interpolate/extrapolate works wonders, but isn't perfect. Make sure your current cell makes sense with all of its neighbors. There will be a trend that the lowest number will be in the upper-left (low MAP and low RPM) and the cells will gradually increase as you proceed down and to the right. They won't always increase though, but there will be a general trend. This is the airflow map of your engine, so there may be some "waves" in the trending. Parts of mine increase 70 GMVE units in neighboring horizontal cells, while other places even slightly decrease. I have a ripple in mine, presumably because of the turbo + cam.

Once you complete all the cells, close the table and return to the main Bluecat window.
There are numerous sliders and options at the left. I do leave "Auto Zone Boundaries" turned off and favor "precision" over "speed." Others on here can give you the best options and it will vary with your car, etc.

Click on the "Generate Equations" button. The graph of your VE Map will show red segments (zones) readjusting to fit your zone values. The graph turns black and red while working. The speed of the calculations depends on your computer speed, etc, but it only takes me about a minute to do the 2.5 bar map. The graph returns to green when done.

Click the "Equations" button and this time do "Export." Very similar concept to import, except as you go into the tables in the VCM editor, you click paste. If you're not doing "Auto Zone Boundaries" the "Zone Map Boundaries" will act like you're not actually pasting anything (no color changes). And be real careful about pasting into the correct tables!

Let me know if you want me to elaborate.

When I get to the VE table it won't let me type in my cylinder displacement.

Sorry but never mind. I got it. Little tricky but figured it out. Thanks for all the good instructions above.

[mcdonald77]

I really appreciate the reply. I will go over them and see if it equates to me...

[Niemer]

It seems that this doesn't work with 2.25, when I use the tool to paste the tables I get incorrect values, any plans on updating this to work with the next incarnation of the editor? Or will it go away since it seems like they are building it into the new version?

[blyne3]

I had the same issue, the MAP Boundaries table in 2.24 is in kpa and in 2.25 it is in psi so the new equations usually won't be small enough. I sent it t Bill.

[Niemer]

That might have been it, I didn't notice that. You can change the units in 2.25 by right clicking in the table and going to 'units' and selecting what you want. Same goes for 2.24.

[alexl226]

VEtable.png

Anyone clear up this issue? This table is what is generated from a stock 07-08 Tahoe/Suburban....someone earlier mentioned trying to use the info from an 09?? Wondering if that was ever tried and if so what were the results....

I'll update tonight when I get home and try for myself if I dont hear back from anyone.

[jpb1972]

Can someone help me out? I tried loading the VE data from my stock e38 OS in an attempt to build a VE table for the 2 bar OS. This is what I ended up with. Any ideas?
Also, the x and y axis are reversed in the bluecat table unless I use a different format.

EDIT: figured out how to edit tables to duplicate os table.

[jpb1972]

Came up with 2 more tables using data from other tunes for similar setups.

[Niemer]

My assumption is that the e38 equations are only good to 4000 rpm and 105kPa since that is when it switches to MAF fueling in the stock tume. I have noticed that if I try and build a table from my known good VVE equations with different axis scaling I get similar results.

You pretty much have to take what you get, do some manual smoothing, and go through a bunch of iterations to get it right. DSteck posted a VE builder worksheet on this forum somewhere a while back, I don't feel comfortable re-posting it without his permission, but if you search hard enough I'm sure it'll pop up. That would at least get the initial smoothing of your data done with relative ease.

[jpb1972]

Thanks. I think I came up with a better table searching through other tunes equivalent to mine. I used the one on the left.

[schpenxel]

Thanks. I think I came up with a better table searching through other tunes equivalent to mine. I used the one on the left.

You have a regular VE table now, yes? 2 bar OS?

Why not tune it like you did the MAF?