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Thread: ETC Closes when going WOT while rolling

  1. #1
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    ETC Closes when going WOT while rolling

    Hello all, have a 2009 G8 that's giving me some grief and looking for some suggestions...

    Here's the problem: if rolling down the road say 50mph and you go WOT, the car will start to take off, then the ETC closes for a split second, then comes right back.

    I have just about every TM setting turned off, but in the log (table) you can see the ETC TqMgtType say 'Trans' when this happens.

    Seems to happen only when it needs to downshift, if you manually drop to 3rd and hit it, no trouble...

    Mods on the car: comp cam (224/230 114), kooks long tubes, and 3600 converter in it.

    Any ideas? I've been trying a ton of TM combinations, but can't seem to get this one...

    Here's the tune/log/cfg (ignore wideband - wasn't hooked up).

    In the log, the problem shows itself at 2.32.756.

    Thanks for any ideas!

  2. #2
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    Timing droping to 5*? Droped to 5* from a 2* KR event then throttle closed
    Last edited by MMGT1; 08-26-2012 at 11:49 AM.
    2000 Trans Am WS6

  3. #3
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    Thanks for the suggestions! I'm looking for any ideas on this one!

    Not sure the KR is the culprit on this one... I have other logs where this same thing happens without any knock... Only happens on a roll when you got WOT and it needs to downshift. If I keep it in manual mode 3rd gear roll, then got WOT, no trouble...

    The 5* you see is actually the TM deal... I have the "Spark Minimum - TqMgt" table set to 5* in there, and that's where it's hitting it. It used to pull -20*... From what I can tell, just about all TM is turned off in the trans so not sure what to say on where that is called from...

    I logged "ETC Source" and "ETC TqMgt Type" to see what's up when this happens, and here's what they say:
    ETC TqMgt Type shows "Trans" when the ETC closes for the split second
    ETC Source shows: Pedal, MaxPos, MinPos (when ETC closes), Torque (when it opens back up), MaxPos, Torque, then finally MaxPos.

    Seems like something on the Trans TM side is causing the ETC to close, but I've just about set everything to 'disabled' or 'none' to try to narrow this one down without any luck.

    Thanks again for the reply!

  4. #4

  5. #5
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    Thanks for the link.
    I only have Fuel Cut enabled for the Control Method, ETC is Disabled. Each of my limits per gear are set to at least 6600 too. Car is an automatic, does the CFCO options control anything?

  6. #6
    Tuner 4evervette's Avatar
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    check ur Trans default torque limit ....max them intially then set them to what ever u like .
    specialize in: V8 Conversion & Tuning (UAE- DUBAI)
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    Salah clutches for Nissan, Toyota and GM car

  7. #7
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    Wow that's wild, I don't know if this would fix it, but give this a try,
    In the Trans section / Torque Management / Torque Reduction / Speed Ctrl Terminate, set it to Immediate, right now you have it set at Torque Ramp.

  8. #8
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    Well, I have this one narrowed to Limit TqMgt in the Trans TM.

    When I have the enable temp set to 300, and all options set to "None", I get this ETC close issue in the log. If I flip these all back to stock: 86 degrees and 'Garage Shift' and 'Default' to 'Throttle Only' this problem goes away!

    BUT - there's always a but, when I flip this back to the stock settings, the car stalls when coming to a stop. Kind of the same feel on this too. When this stall happens the "ETC TqMgtType" says "trans" and "Torque Mgt Advance" shows upwards of 22* and the timing drops enough to stall the car. Of course the car runs perfect and does not stall when Limit TqMgt in the trans is all shut off.

    Here's a very short log of it stalling (same CFG as above). You can see it happening at 0:05:662. The timing drop drops the idle and it will only recover if you put the car in neutral.

    Sooo, catch 22 here. If I disable these TM's, the stalling issue goes away. If I re-enable them, the ETC closes when I go WOT.

    Anyone else ever see this? What exactly does this Limit TM do? I've read several search results, but this one is pretty gray.


    Thanks again everyone.

  9. #9
    Tuner blkscooby's Avatar
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    The only thing I can see for the stalling issue may be your Spark/ Advance/ Idle Adaptive Spark Control tables. Vastly different than mine (granted I don't have my cam in yet.) The Overspeed table has almost 11* less timing than mine (which I think is stock). Basically, when you are coming to a stop in gear and if the idle is off due to the cam tune, it will cut timing and could cause a stall.

  10. #10
    Senior Tuner Higgs Boson's Avatar
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    I've been able to leave idle spark correction tables stock on some decent sized cams. if yours is not stock I would make it so and see.

  11. #11
    try re-enabling CT downshift Torque Reduction, this is only used for closed throttle downshifts, also try changing Speed Ctrl Terminate to Imeediate.

    The Tip-In, Flare and LImit TqMgt options are onlu "suggestyions" to the ECM on what tqmgt method to use, they are not absolute. ie. None means the TCM makes no suggestion as to how the ECM should acheive the tqmgt, it doesn't mean disable it.
    I count sheep in hex...