Can I have some input and/or help with my tune?

[bonylad]

Im basically just trying to smooth out my maps, and lean it out a little.

The tune is still the basic ZZP tune I got with the ZZP 1.0 PCM. Car has a 2.8/60s/ZZP mid length catted dp/stock exhaust/ZZP 3 inch CAI/ZZP S2 heat exchanger.

1. Tune worked fine, I am just trying to make it a lil less.........canned.

2. My cfg sucks, I cant get it to show me boost or knock.....boo.

3. Looking for input on how best to proceed. I used my ltfts to lean it out a lil.....no wideband. Thats only by tweaking the PE table from 1.3 to 1.29...........

So, please find attached my tune and a quick lil run to 60 ish......with a/c on boo.

Thanks for any input!

[GM COBALT SC SS]

for #1. look on the redline forums for the how tos on dialing in maf and ve. lots of good info there.

2. youll have to go in the table (primary) and insert it there before kr or any other parameter will show up.

3. dont touch pe to adjust ltft or stft. dont adjust pe at all other than to create the commanded afr that you want based on the eq ratio. youre gonna dial in the maf and ve with fuel trims to get the afrs close.

good luck with the tuning. ive got a similar setup, but with no cooling

[GM COBALT SC SS]

you are running stock-like injector settings on 60s? and your idle shouldnt be 700 rpm. i dont see how this could run fine, unless theres something im missing

edit: i see what they did here. they lowered the airflow so that the injector settings would not have a flow rate modifier. there was an article on this type of scaling on the injector dynamics website, but i dont see why it would be necessary with 60s. maybe someone can explain this

[bonylad]

suggestions on idle speed?

wont adjusting the pe table affect my afr, thereby my short and long term fuel trims? i know the pe table is for wot, and the others need to be adjusted to all other situations.

can you help me? tweak it or anything? please also do you have a config worth a damn!? lol
thanks!

[bonylad]

"Pulling power enrichment and losing power? That makes no sense at all. If your car is running pig rich a WOT, and you dont know how to tune your maf, which i can tell you have no clue, you can take small amounts out of the power enrichment values to achieve the afr you want. Power enrichment doesnt make your car faster, it makes WOT safe."

-BlackBaltSw

Does this not apply? If not then I will adjust it back the .10 I took out! lol.

I know asking for handouts is frowned upon, but with the tunes in the repository SO descriptive.....I wonder is there one already out there to compare mine to?

If I took the 60s spreadsheet and plugged it in, what else would I have to change? You said you noted they lowered the airflow?

Ugg.....Im thinking of taking a stock tune, plugging in the GMS2 timing tables, the pe tables from the ZZP tune, and 60s spreadsheet.......

thoughts?

[cobaltssoverbooster]

The lsj is very vehicle specific it's not like an lnf where we can compare one car to the other and the only changes are minor between a few tables.

It is highly recommend to read up and get used to the program first. Then find out how to adjust everything else. I believe the hardest thing to grasp is the injectors but it has been made easy by a few of the loyal members here. Just read all that u can find on your vehicle. Most of the links have been organized in a lsj thread to get people started.

[GM COBALT SC SS]

playing around with the PE will only affect the afrs under pe. it will not, in any way, alter the ltfts and stfts that youll see. if you watch your log, when you go wot, youll see the ltft stay right at the value it was prior to going wot and the stft will go to zero. this is under PE and the trims arent being used. hope that makes sense. what im saying is trims dont matter under wot and you wont help the fuel trims by altering pe. you can get the wot afr close this way, but it is the incorrect way of doing it

ltft and stft are only used when the commanded afr is at the stoich value which for our cars is 14.69971 or whatever. every year is different and that is not what matters. all that matters is that you will use fuel trims for tuning only at a commanded stoich. and the wideband for PE. ill try to post up one of my configs in a minute and explain how you do so

[GM COBALT SC SS]

first things first. do you have a wideband? because you are gonna need one to tune for wot and youll need hpt pro to link it in with the scanner. secondly, i can tell you how to tune the trims to get them close, but thats about the extent i can help. your tuner scaled everything in your file so that you would have no ifr modifier. this article explains scaling, but i dont really care to learn it as it is only needed if your running like 2000 cc injectors. which is 198 #/hr roughly. im never gonna put out that kind of power but w/e
heres the link http://www.injectordynamics.com/SteckScaleArticle.html

now look in the attachments. if you open the screenshot, look at the primary table. insert all the pids listed on my table minus the ones with a line through them. they are custom pids. there is one custom pid that will be usefull to you for tuning airflow now and it is ltft + stft. look at the second screenshot and you will see the setup for the custom parameter ltft + stft youll need. i added the 1 on the end which is unnecessary, but for a little safety net to make it richer rather than leaner. its totally unnecessary. try to make the custom pid in the same #5 spot as mine is in. i think itll make tuning the trims easier on the histogram.

now, go to histograms 3,4 and 6 in the config attached. these are the tables that youll use to tune maf and ve based on the fuel trims. youll run a log and copy the entire table and paste special multiply and subtract by, on the original tune. http://www.redlineforums.com/forums/...ve-tuning.html explains this and has a short video of it in action lol. screenshot 3 will show you the setup needed for the maf in the vcm editor. screenshot 4 will show you the setup needed in the tune to run the ve.

if you have any questions, just ask. i didnt really go over why you do all this, because im feeling lazy. but i tried to make it as simple as possible. hopefully i didnt miss a step.

[bonylad]

WOW. First off I want to thank you for helping me out! It takes awhile to type all that and add some attachments, so you definitely spent some time there. EBEER!

Im Mr. Mom this week (wifes flying to CT) so Im probably not gonna have time this week to try all this. I will this weekend for sure.

Ill be honest it makes me a lil leary to do all this, but Ill try!

I do have Pro, but no wideband at this time.

Im putting together a scratch tune now....just to see how it works. I took a stock SS/SC tune, added GMS2 timing and everything from the HOWTO 60s.hpt including maf/ve tables. Havent run it yet........

Thanks again for all your time, I know you took it

[bonylad]

soo......i put that custom tune in.

my ltfts go to zero and the car feels like shit......

quick run............to like 60ish...not really getting on it.

im going to put the zzp canned tune back in for now......till i figure this out.

[GM COBALT SC SS]

quick question. what do you mean by custom tune.. what all did you change?

quick recap of what you said you were changing..
60s from spreadsheet - okay
gms2 timing - okay
pe values from zzp tune - i dont see why it would not be okay

but there are a few issues with things you did not touch. as i mentioned, they scaled the airflow down so that the fueling could be scaled down. therefore, if you change your fueling to the 60s spreadsheet, youre also gonna have to change the airflow.. drastically. do not go wot on that custom tune your talking about, because im running a 2.8 also and my airflow numbers are about double what yours are. this is due to the scaling im talking about.

the tune zzp gave you should be good. if youd like, i can post up my tune so you can compare the 2. but itll take a little reading before it all will make sense.

and no problem. i try to help out where i can. i remember when i was overwhelmed with the learning process. itll take time, but youll get it if you stay with it

[GM COBALT SC SS]

this is my base file with some tweaking to the maf, ve, pe ratio, torque management zeroed out, boost maxed and the basline ottp tune timing.

i would not recommend just loading a similar tune and running it as is, because your canned tune will be safe. and im not sure about my pe ratio. it may be alittle too lean early in the power band, but ah well

[bonylad]

heres my zzp tune for comparison. input and thoughts? thanks again!

[bonylad]

i also have this one..........which is off the repos. which out of the three (including yours) LOOKS the best?

[GM COBALT SC SS]

well, its not a matter of what looks the best. its a matter of what is safest for your car. hands down, thatd be the canned tune you were given. the one out of the repository has alot of added timing in the upper levels, which may not be a big deal, but it could cause some knock. i wouldnt throw in a table with 10 more degrees than stock in any area without some octane. maybe im alittle scared, but ah well lol.

if you set up the config on your scanner, you can tailor your tune for optimum power easily. lsjs are simple to tune. and i dont mind helping along the way because i have nothing going on until school starts on the 20th lol but there is nothing wrong with your tune. you may not make quite the power youd like just yet, but its a good idea to learn the process and do it all yourself so that it is tailored to your car.

[bonylad]

i see your point. I have learned timing is what causes some serious damage, people advancing it toooooo much and all that.

in your experience whats the difference between gms2 timing and mine? i really just wanna lean it out a lil.....thats all. it blows black smoke and int. throws rich codes.......ugg

thanks again for your help, kind words and its appreciated. hopefully some good tunes are being tossed around and even better ideas and info. maybe somebody else in the community is getting something outta this too.

[GM COBALT SC SS]

the timing gets scaled too so comparing the two isnt possible without knowing how much zzp scaled this tune. if you find out the scale factor, then you can multiply the table by that value and compare the two. or you could set up your logger and see how much your running. i think the cfg that comes with the scanner should log timing correctly. then you could compare. but i wouldnt do it unless your just interested

since your getting rich codes, ill post up my ott canned tune you can run that and see how it turns out for you. i never ran into rich or lean codes with it for the few weeks i ran it before i tweaked it. just make sure you log for knock to see if you are getting any or not. you shouldnt however. and dont bother worrying about tip in knock, thats normal

and no problem. i like talking about this sh** lol

[cobaltssoverbooster]

Every table with a g/cyl axis must be rescaled or the scaling won't work correctly. If you want to move away from the scale start over with a fresh tune.

[GM COBALT SC SS]

Every table with a g/cyl axis must be rescaled or the scaling won't work correctly. If you want to move away from the scale start over with a fresh tune.

good call. thats what i was trying to say when i posted up the canned ott tune i have for a 2.8 and 60s, but couldnt articulate it correctly lol

[cobaltssoverbooster]

its cool man same sames lol