3-4 shift 6l80E track only...

[bluegoat06]

I'm on a roll, lol. Here is my latest file. PCS2 still did the same thing, but no lag. I upped all the oncoming volume presets. Excellent, excellent... plus a better part throttle shift. I then copied the 3-4sp oncoming and offgoing pressure presets from the CTS-V as well as the Shift initial and Shift final transition % 3-4sp.

I also tweaked all the shift points based off of MPH only and increased the shift RPM the equivalent. It is all nearly perfect. I plan on raising the 3-4 shift a bit more, but I really need a track. I just don't have that many test spots There was no lag and the shifts really pushed the car forward, even with 100% tq management on 1-2 and 2-3.

Can someone try out all the parameters, including the torque management, but leave all your shift points the same?

Morgan, Looking in more details, you said you copied the stock CTS-V oncoming/offgoing pressure preset for the 3-4sp ?, but I think by mistake you zeroed out the oncoming pressure preset values in your tune compared to a 09 CTS-V, can you double check it ?

I'm preparing the file i'll be loading in my car. I guess i would be using all the oncoming volume preset values from the the CTS-V as well, i compared your last file vs a CTS-V and they're the same values.

I'll keep everything else i have the same in the test, the only difference would be the Oncoming/offgoing preset for the 3-4 sp shift, and all oncoming volume preset values, which would be coming from the CTS-V like you did.

[carneb]

It would be nice to know exactly what the y-axis 0 1 2 means though.

The 0 1 2 refer to different torque loads. 0 is low torque, 1 is medium torque, 2 is high torque. I thought Chris did a post a while back that mentioned the actual torque values of each band but I can't find it now

[bluegoat06]

Morgan, i loaded the tune tonight and made a couple of tests, a 1-2 run, and 1-2,2-3 run
Here are the logs and tune, i couldn't test the 3-4 shift.

[04blackgmc]

still going guys? lol..
i havent messed with mine much at all besides getting rid of the TCC lock in 4th...

really havent had a desire to go back to the track.. car has been running its ass off on the street without a single issue with the 3-4

[04blackgmc]

ok i read some more... so ur seeing some improved results with a increase in the oncoming and offgoing pressure preset tables?

[04blackgmc]

btw looking at the 08/09 vette ctsv and '10 camaro all have 3-8 more on the 3-4 oncoming volume preset

[morgan72]

bluegoat06, how did the shifts feel to you with that setting, part and at WOT? The zero values are for the min pressure.

Make sure you grab all the values. The shift initial/final transition % for 3-4 sp are different as well.

I've been driving the car around today with now changes. It's feeling pretty good. My only gripe is the trans needs to be about 140 to really get the nice part throttle shifts.

I'm heading to the track tomorrow. Now if I can just get the downshift when I come to a stop to be smoother.

[bluegoat06]

She feels pretty good so far, like the shifts times are even shorter, i didn't modify the shift initial/final transition, and the oncoming/offgoing pressure for the 3-4 sp are exactly like the 09 cts-v, same for the oncoming volume preset for all gears. i'll post the 3-4 run once i'm able to get a log with it.

Also for the downshift, are you having the problem going from 3-1 ? try to lower the 2-1 shift to 3 or 4mph instead of 6mph. my 3-2 is modified and i was having a jerky shift if i had set the 3-2 too high, but also, i think having speed crtl termination back to stock helped a lot, and having that one back to stop was also something i did to stop the 3-4 issue at the track. this was based in observations only, that's why i'm not touching that one yet

[bluegoat06]

ok i read some more... so ur seeing some improved results with a increase in the oncoming and offgoing pressure preset tables?

Shifting feels nicer but i don't want to preset your mind and affect your SOPT feel
i haven't tried the 3-4 shift at the track yet, she was fine on the street with my last tune, and the logs showed the same. i'll drive with this settings for a while, hopefully i have a 3-4 street log soon, but to test this at the track will take longer, at least until October

[morgan72]

That 3-1 stop is a pain. With it stock, it drags the motor down and then recovers right before the stop. When I lowered the shift point it comes to a stop with a lot more load on the brakes and then I feel it jerk into first. Doesn't help I still have the stock converter and my idle is at 750.

I just made a bunch of changes to the shift times on coast down 3-1 3-2 and 2-1 to see if that will help.

[8850]

That 3-1 stop is a pain. With it stock, it drags the motor down and then recovers right before the stop. When I lowered the shift point it comes to a stop with a lot more load on the brakes and then I feel it jerk into first. Doesn't help I still have the stock converter and my idle is at 750.

I just made a bunch of changes to the shift times on coast down 3-1 3-2 and 2-1 to see if that will help.

That fast idle is why you get the jerk on coatsdown. Too fast for factory converter. I can idle mine about 625 maximum.

[bluegoat06]

That 3-1 stop is a pain. With it stock, it drags the motor down and then recovers right before the stop. When I lowered the shift point it comes to a stop with a lot more load on the brakes and then I feel it jerk into first. Doesn't help I still have the stock converter and my idle is at 750.

I just made a bunch of changes to the shift times on coast down 3-1 3-2 and 2-1 to see if that will help.

You can fix that with the RAF, look at the WB54 file i posted, and look at my RAF min table. compare that to stock.
I think you said you have a cam, so you'll have to do a little touch up in your RAF table, probably for the 800,600 and 400rpm. if you haven't done so, try adding 1 g/sec in those rpm for 1st gear as a test, and use the stock shift points at low part throttle.

How big is your cam?, can you get her to idle at 650rpm?, like 8850 said, 750 might too much for the stock verter. i wish i had experience with a cammed G8 though (maybe in a couple of months i'll do something to my car...)

My LS2 GTO with a 228/228 cam (she had an M6 trans though) was idling at 700rpm like a kitty, and i went as low as 600rpm just for the sake of it. i made her go to 700rpm in the end just because i didn't like the oil pressure readings at 600rpm, but she drove fine at 600rpm. cam only, 4* overlap, and at 600rpm, the lope was more chopey, loved it, and things like this 3-4 shift issues make miss that T56 trans.

[morgan72]

copied over your RAF min table and lowered my idle to 650 RPM. We'll see how that works. I think I just need to get the converter in the car, but hopefully this helps it out a bit. Thanks

Off to the track. Did a freeway blast and have the 3-4 working nice at 6800 rpm. We shall see...

[bluegoat06]

Good luck man.

[morgan72]

Good news, I solved the problem. Bad news, it had nothing to do with my changes.

The answer... hot lapping. After being thoroughly pissed off because the car was still having issues, I had a let's see moment and hot lapped.

so here is how it went.
Long cool down best of the day 12.23 @ 116.1

Let it cool down for a while
12.26 @ 115.8

Hot lap 1
12.15 @ 117.1

Hot lap 2
12.13 @ 116.9

Hot lap 3
car spun a bit
12.25 @ 116.7

Every run the shifts were rock solid. I turned off torque management in 2-3 and 3-4 but I was running 50% on 1-2 to keep from blowing off the tires too bad. After it started shifting well, I was afraid to raise the shift point on the 3-4, but it was about 6600 rpm and I want 6800.

I don't have any logs on the hot lap (I know my bad), but the question is now, why?
Is there some sort of start up timer. Usually I don't leave the car running in the lanes, but I left it on 2 hot lap with an average of 5 min between runs.
Does the tranny need some run time? Could it be a low fluid issue? The tranny was plenty warm and the fluid even after cool down was about 150deg.

I am at a loss. I am wondering if there is some sort of start up timer in the code or a lookup we don't see. It had nothing to do with switching from D to S to M. Every run I do a burnout in M1 and M2 and then click to drive and then back to sport before I launch.

Now I just need better weather, new best today in worse weather.

[bluegoat06]

Interesting to note that when i had those 2 clean runs as well on my last track visit, , there were hot laps as well, the track was about to close, and i was about to cry after changing crap up in the tune for 8 runs with no luck. i went to eat, made the change, loaded the new tune, and drove straight to the track, didn't park the car to allow the engine to cool down or anything, i just drove straight to the staging lanes and did my first run, no issues, went at it again inmediatly after that one, no issues.

[bluegoat06]

Oh Morgan BTW, great times considering you're still using the stock verter. what were your 60's ?

[C5pilot]

I am at a loss. I am wondering if there is some sort of start up timer in the code or a lookup we don't see. It had nothing to do with switching from D to S to M. Every run I do a burnout in M1 and M2 and then click to drive and then back to sport before I launch.

Now I just need better weather, new best today in worse weather.

Nice times.

The C6 is the same way. If the DA remains constant, you will shave off time for about 3 runs by hot lapping. After that it levels off, making it difficult to bracket race at a busy track where the laps are unevenly spaced. (ie hard to run your dial early in the day and breaking out as you near the finals)

150* is on the cool side for A6 trans temps, you'll run faster as you approach 180-200*. I have a B&M trans cooler which helps keep temps a little more consistent. I know it's costing me time but I'm a bracket racer where consistency wins.

PS. I don't know if you're aware of the odd behavior of the A6 after doing a burnout using paddles. A C6 won't shift correctly during the following run unless you do the burnout in D or S, or like you mentioned, cycle the shifter through all the positions. A number of us have lost a few races from that issue. I assume it afflicts all A6's.

[thesubfloor]

PS. I don't know if you're aware of the odd behavior of the A6 after doing a burnout using paddles. A C6 won't shift correctly during the following run unless you do the burnout in D or S, or like you mentioned, cycle the shifter through all the positions. A number of us have lost a few races from that issue. I assume it afflicts all A6's.

This sounds like it might only apply to you as I've never experienced that. I used to do my burnout in D and let it shift through as many gears as it wanted to but recently I've been doing it in S, starting from 1st and shifting into 2nd. Afterwards I just roll out, pop it back into D and go.

What kind of problems have you been seeing when it acts up?

[C5pilot]

This sounds like it might only apply to you as I've never experienced that. I used to do my burnout in D and let it shift through as many gears as it wanted to but recently I've been doing it in S, starting from 1st and shifting into 2nd. Afterwards I just roll out, pop it back into D and go.

What kind of problems have you been seeing when it acts up?

It's well documented on Corvette Forum, at least for all LS2 C6's, not sure if it's an issue with LS3's. If you use paddle mode to do a burnout and simply go to D and back to S mode, you will get hesitation through your shifts at WOT.

The solution is to cycle the shift lever all the way through Reverse and back, then stage and launch. I personally saw the problem duplicated and resolved in 3 C6's at the track and with at least another racer online.

That being said, this issue was found before 2.23 was released so I don't know if all the new trans settings changed anything.