LS2 Horsepower peaking @ 4800rpm

[[email protected]]

I'm am tuning my first E38 LS2 and I have the MAF tune dialed in fairly close. Attached are my config, hpl and hpt file. I have the wideband signal going to our dyno so don't look for the signal in the hpl. The MAF Disable/Enable are set at 200/100. A/F is 14.7/14.9 at 900rpm idle and has a smooth curve to 12.9@5000 which is the highest I have taken it so far.

My questions are:
1. How much spark advance should I be running at WOT at 3-5000rpm?
2.The horsepower is peaking at 4800 rpm, is this unusual for the LS2?

There is no obvious KR, the car is making 396rwhp on a Mustang IMP-SE. The pull recorded was in 4th gear.

Any thoughts/recommendations?

[RWTD]

Peaking at 4800? It should peak at 6k+, depending on mods. Are you "overloading" it on the Mustang, thereby causing the car to struggle?

Edit: Looking at your logs, MY GOD, quit logging ALL of that. That KILLS your resolution, on top of NOT even needing 3/4 of what you are logging for tuning WOT.

[[email protected]]

Peaking at 4800? It should peak at 6k+, depending on mods. Are you "overloading" it on the Mustang, thereby causing the car to struggle?

Edit: Looking at your logs, MY GOD, quit logging ALL of that. That KILLS your resolution, on top of NOT even needing 3/4 of what you are logging for tuning WOT.

Sorry about logging so much.... I copied the config off of this site and when I opened it to scan I was going nuts. I tried to delete some of the PID's but it wouldn't let me so I left it alone and logged away.

I don't think I'm overloading it but it was a 4th gear pull. The car did not struggle at all to hit 5k. There are NO mods to this engine.

We actually don't know what this car weighs. It's another 09 GTM without the body. With the body they weigh around 2500lbs so I entered 2100lbs for the weight.

[BBA]

The reason it peaks at 4800 is the factory PE curve and PE enable delay. You want about 12.3 from idle to 6400 RPM for the highest and flattest power band.

[RWTD]

I must respectfully disagree. The LS2 peaks at approx. 6k from the factory, even on the stock tune. Furthermore, there is no functional PE delay on the C6 (including the F-Bods, GTOs, C5s, and many other V8 cars), so setting the PE Enable RPM to 0 does nothing, since the PE Enable Timer, which isn't in HPT's templates, is already set to 0 on these vehicles.

[kgb]

. ...there is no functional PE delay on the C6 ...the PE Enable Timer, which isn't in HPT's templates, is already set to 0 on these vehicles.

When I lower the PE Enable Delay RPM value (default is 5000) on my C6/M6 2005 it becomes much more responsive. In fact when I've dropped it to about 3500 in the past, I began noticing audible knock/pinging or whatever you want to call it. So there is something going on with my car when I change this setting. I just keep mine's set to 5000rpm.

[RWTD]

When I lower the PE Enable Delay RPM value (default is 5000) on my C6/M6 2005 it becomes much more responsive. In fact when I've dropped it to about 3500 in the past, I began noticing audible knock/pinging or whatever you want to call it. So there is something going on with my car when I change this setting. I just keep mine's set to 5000rpm.

Actually, if u look at the logic, it has zero function on the C6, so what you're feeling, & I am not demeaning you, is just mindgames, bud. ;-)

[kgb]

Actually, if u look at the logic, it has zero function on the C6, so what you're feeling, & I am not demeaning you, is just mindgames, bud. ;-)

With all respect, I don't care about the logic. I'm only relating what I experienced in my C6 when I change the setting: i.e. pinging and much better throttle response. I also notice when I set it to zero, my gas mileage decreases. None of this is surprising to me, though, based on my understanding of what the setting is doing. It might do you some good to learn to use your feeling mechanism as well.

[RWTD]

You can't argue with the logic/code of the calibration. It doesn't allow that parameter to perform ANY function on the C6, nor the other vehicle I mentioned above. When the "PE Delay Timer" is set to "0" already, it defeats the function of the "PE Delay RPM" 100%. That's how the code is written, and that's what it does and doesn't do.

Furthermore, when you reflash your pcm, you're also clearing out your adaptive logic, which could also be part of what you're "feeling".

[kgb]

You can't argue with the logic/code of the calibration. It doesn't allow that parameter to perform ANY function on the C6, nor the other vehicle I mentioned above. When the "PE Delay Timer" is set to "0" already, it defeats the function of the "PE Delay RPM" 100%. That's how the code is written, and that's what it does and doesn't do.

Furthermore, when you reflash your pcm, you're also clearing out your adaptive logic, which could also be part of what you're "feeling".

I am relating to you my direct experience and you are in effect telling me I am imagining what I am feeling (SOTP), hearing (pinging), and measuring (decreased gas mileage), based on your mental understanding of things?

Knowledge is infinite; this means your knowledge is incomplete.

And I have flashed/reset my PCM many, many times and know the effect it has on driveablity--I can FEEL it.

[BBA]

I must respectfully disagree. The LS2 peaks at approx. 6k from the factory, even on the stock tune. Furthermore, there is no functional PE delay on the C6 (including the F-Bods, GTOs, C5s, and many other V8 cars), so setting the PE Enable RPM to 0 does nothing, since the PE Enable Timer, which isn't in HPT's templates, is already set to 0 on these vehicles.

Probably a difference between the car intake and the TBSS vortec intake, mine peaked at 4800 RPM factory tune with PE table spike at the corresponding RPM, but after tuning the peak is 4200 RPM, and power is up at all RPM's, although it falls off on accelleration above 6200 RPM.

[BBA]

I'm am tuning my first E38 LS2 and I have the MAF tune dialed in fairly close. Attached are my config, hpl and hpt file. I have the wideband signal going to our dyno so don't look for the signal in the hpl. The MAF Disable/Enable are set at 200/100. A/F is 14.7/14.9 at 900rpm idle and has a smooth curve to 12.9@5000 which is the highest I have taken it so far.

My questions are:
1. How much spark advance should I be running at WOT at 3-5000rpm?
2.The horsepower is peaking at 4800 rpm, is this unusual for the LS2?

There is no obvious KR, the car is making 396rwhp on a Mustang IMP-SE. The pull recorded was in 4th gear.

Any thoughts/recommendations?

I finally looked at your log...why is your B2S1 O2 sensor not reading the same as the bank 1? Did you pull it to put in the wideband sensor (which was not reading)?

[RWTD]

...based on your mental understanding of things?

I'm not trying to say you're crazy, trust me.

Have you ever studied code? If you look at the specific logic of that calibration, you will see there is absolutely nothing that parameter can do when the PE Delay Timer is set to 0. It's a "compliment" of the PE Delay Timer (and others). You just cannot argue with GM's programmers here.

I do not have it right on front of me, but the code reads, in essence (layman's terms coming up):

- if 'PE Delay RPM' is > 0 then PE will be delayed until that rpm by amount of time set in 'PE Delay Timer'.
- if 'PE Delay Timer' = 0 then PE will be never be delayed.

[[email protected]]

I finally looked at your log...why is your B2S1 O2 sensor not reading the same as the bank 1? Did you pull it to put in the wideband sensor (which was not reading)?

Yep! Good guess/deduction

[kgb]

I'm not trying to say you're crazy, trust me.

Have you ever studied code? If you look at the specific logic of that calibration, you will see there is absolutely nothing that parameter can do when the PE Delay Timer is set to 0. It's a "compliment" of the PE Delay Timer (and others). You just cannot argue with GM's programmers here.

I do not have it right on front of me, but the code reads, in essence (layman's terms coming up):

- if 'PE Delay RPM' is > 0 then PE will be delayed until that rpm by amount of time set in 'PE Delay Timer'.
- if 'PE Delay Timer' = 0 then PE will be never be delayed.

I am not (really) arguing with GM's programmers or you. I know nothing about GM's programming. Again, I am relating my sense experience after changng the setting using HPTuners. I'm sure there is an explanation for what is happening here; however, your reply is not it.

There is no substitute for direct experience which is direct knowledge.

Good day.

[RWTD]

I am not (really) arguing with GM's programmers or you. I know nothing about GM's programming. Again, I am relating my sense experience after changng the setting using HPTuners. I'm sure there is an explanation for what is happening here; however, your reply is not it.

Yes it is the explanation: That parameter does absolutely NOTHING if you change it on your particular vehicle, therefore what's happening in your "sensory" department is NOT related to that parameter. Good evening.

Probably a difference between the car intake and the TBSS vortec intake, mine peaked at 4800 RPM factory tune with PE table spike at the corresponding RPM, but after tuning the peak is 4200 RPM, and power is up at all RPM's, although it falls off on accelleration above 6200 RPM.

Hey bud, just wanted to let you know he's running a 2006 C6 calibration, so if it is actually an LS2 C6, it should be peaking right at 6k.

[GregRexAdams]

I am not (really) arguing with GM's programmers or you. I know nothing about GM's programming. Again, I am relating my sense experience after changng the setting using HPTuners. I'm sure there is an explanation for what is happening here; however, your reply is not it.

There is no substitute for direct experience which is direct knowledge.

Good day.

RWTD is just trying to be helpful.

If you want the proof, hook up a wideband, crank the delay all the way up, and log it. Then crank it all the way down. You'll know for yourself then with PROPER data