E40 sd tuning the ve table

[PurplePiss]

In the SDtuningguide it says to set a few tables so that they are multiply out to 1. My tables match the screen shots. Do I need to change anything? Some of them are :

Open Loop EQ Ratio Gas (Gear) and (PN) are set to 10.00's.
Open Loop Airflow Gain vs map vs rpm is set to 1.0000
Open Loop EQ ration min vs ect is set to all 1.00's when its warm
Open Loop IVT Gain vs. IVT vs MAP are set to what is shown in the screen shot.
Open Loop injector gain
Do I need to modify anything here?

Once you upload the sd tune, should you clear the fuel trims?

I am filtering tps < 18 and greater than 80% out. Hit count is 30. Taking the average out of the ve afr error histogram.

All that being said, my first 2 iterations are showing normal driving/average load % error numbers of -1 to -5, but when I go WOT I'm seeing -7 to -21. I'm commanding 12.8 and getting 11.9. How can a basically stock car be that far off? I have had COT turned off for a long time, could the cats be doing something?

COT is disabled
LTFT and stft disabled
DFCO disabled
Maf unplugged, p0101-p0103 set to 0 on first mil, maf failed by putting in 0,0
PE set to 12.8
Closed loop enable set to 306
Closed loop ready set to 493


Jason

[bluegoat06]

Post the HPT file you're using.

Did you leave the VE table stock ?

Open Loop EQ Ratio Gas (Gear) and (PN) are set to 10.00's.
Set everything to 1

Open Loop IVT Gain vs. IVT vs MAP are set to what is shown in the screen shot.
Set everything to 1

Open Loop injector gain
Do I need to modify anything here?

I changed the values from 203F and 24 sec all the way down and to the right, on all those cells to 1, left all the other cells stock in this table.

[ktoonsez]

Need to see the tune file and I'll be able to see what is wrong.

[PurplePiss]

Hmm... once I read that, it clicked. I did change the VE table because of the file I was comparing to (Midwest).

It is intersting though that Bluegoat says we need to change some tables. I didn't get that from the guide, or maybe it wasn't clear. I'm not the sharpest crayon in the box sometimes.

OK, so we are in agreement that the:
Open Loop EQ Ratio Gas (Gear) and (PN) are set to 10.00's.
Set everything to 1

Open Loop IVT Gain vs. IVT vs MAP are set to what is shown in the screen shot.
Set everything to 1

What about the other tables shown in the guide?

When you get your results, do you put them in Excel so you can filter out cells that are 0 to -2 already and only massage cells above that by half the value?

What about temp filter bias? Since I relocated the IAT sensor (Omega mod) to just before the TB, should I adjust that more toward air temp and farther away from ECT?

With my mods, would you expect just the top end to lean out?

Thanks for your time.
Jason

[PurplePiss]

Forgot the attachments. I'm using Historgram #9 to tune.

[PurplePiss]

Here is tomorrow mornings' modified tune based on our discussion.

[ktoonsez]

When you get your results, do you put them in Excel so you can filter out cells that are 0 to -2 already and only massage cells above that by half the value?


Thanks for your time.
Jason

You can either use excel to fix the numbers that only have a few hits and the areas you didn't hit from an RPM line or just paste them and then smooth them in HPTuner using the graph or typing into the grid. Looking at your scans you have very little data in there, I hope you are logging much more than that to do your adjustments. Basically a good logging session is maxing out the log file, 65000 frames give or take. Make sure when you are in the lower airflow areas you move the throttle in and out nice and easy, no sudden movements or PE will skew the numbers for those lower regions and of course you can hammer it when you are trying to fill in the higher airflow areas.

[PurplePiss]

Ok, I'm getting decent data now.

I went to the track and logged 3 runs to try and get the WOT part of the VE table corrected. How can I filter out the burnout? Can you clip frames?

What histogram do I use to correct the ve table? Does it come by default with the hpt install?

[ktoonsez]

I don't think it has one by default. You need to set up a histogram that has the same rows and columns as your VE table based one the percentage difference between command and actual AFR.

[PurplePiss]

Does anyone have a config with the least number of variables required to do VE tuning on an E40?

Can someone recommend a filter string?

Has anyone corrected their VE table on an LS2 GTO with just a CAI and catback? What areas did you need to add fuel to (assuming)?

I see that when you install HPT you get a histogram called "VE - AFR Error.hst" and 2 other ones that are geared toward 98 2 bar and E38 2 bar. Would the VE - AFR Error histogram work on my E40 or do I need to create one like ktoonsez, said?

How do you deal with the lean condition on warm startup? Is it ok to drive like that until it corrects?

Should I set the Bias Filter table to 1 since I did the Omega IAT mod or is the jury still out on that?

Thanks,
Jason

[ktoonsez]

Unfortunately I use an LC-1 WB that is hooked up to my ac pressure switch so I don't have a good .cfg for you. But it is really easy, just add your WB into the scanner and setup the histo with the columns and rows that match the VE table using the % difference between actual and command AFR. Just do a search for E40 configs and I am sure it will turn up a butt load.

[redhardsupra]

or just learn how to make one proper, so you dont have to rely on other people and their (often wrong) configs

[PurplePiss]

Well, I'm sure everyone here wishes they were as smart as you Marcin. Your something else dude.

Yesterday, it was about 78 degrees out and I did some highway driving. After the IAT stabilized to 95 deg and everything was warm I started logging. The cells were all -2 to -4. Hit some traffic and crawled for awhile and the IAT went up to 125. The car immediately went +2 to +3 lean. How do you tune your VE then if IAT moves your results that much?

[ktoonsez]

That should go away when you set your loop tables (from post #1) back to stock. I never did that while tuning and when my car gets higher IAT it gets richer, not leaner so I think that will go away, try putting loop tables back to stock and I'll bet that is what you'll will see.

[PurplePiss]

Thanks for you reply.

I remember hearing that people were setting the bias to 1 to move it more toward ECT. What was the final verdict on that? Does that fix the lean startup issue?

I'm about to throw in the towel on this. I suspect my Volant intake is making the car lean on the top end of the rpm range and the trims are adding to my PE when I go WOT. Would it be ok to jack that area of the VE table and let the computer trim it back out again so I don't have positive trims being added to my pe curve?

[ktoonsez]

I have not messed with the bias table because I have not seen the need so I can't really answer that part. The fuel trims are disabled at WOT so that is not doing anything to you. Trims should be disabled when doing VE/MAF tuning, I think you know that but just in case I thought i'd mention that. When I tuned my VE table I kept the entire table 2-4% on the rich side so when conditions existed that made the car lean out a little I would be on the safe side, so Yes it is OK to make that area richer. Also remember that if you are turning the MAF back on when you are seeing these lean conditions that would be because you haven't tuned in your MAF table yet. Both VE and MAF tables must be tuned in before you can evaluate these conditions you are talking about.

[PurplePiss]

My understanding is that trims DO affect WOT if your trims are lean. In order to be safe, they add the positive trims to the PE curve. Thus if your in a cell that is +2 when you punch it, you will see 2% more fuel than the commanded PE curve. If the cell is negative trim, nothing is added to the curve. Maybe I'm totally off base here, but my understanding was that this was for safety. That's why I'm thinking I should just jack the table since I can't get enough data in the WOT cells... just let the computer compensate by leaning it out for me with the NB's. Backwoods tuning yes, but it may help keep me from going crazy.

[bluegoat06]

Well, I'm sure everyone here wishes they were as smart as you Marcin. Your something else dude.

Yesterday, it was about 78 degrees out and I did some highway driving. After the IAT stabilized to 95 deg and everything was warm I started logging. The cells were all -2 to -4. Hit some traffic and crawled for awhile and the IAT went up to 125. The car immediately went +2 to +3 lean. How do you tune your VE then if IAT moves your results that much?

If you're tuning VE, then you must avoid any kind of traffic. At least that's what i did for a good while when i was tuning my VE tables. i found the same thing you're seen, hotter IAT's would give you leaner conditions, Cooler IAT's would give richer conditions. don't worry about the Bias if you're going to run in Close Loop at the end. concentrate on a more safe VE table. since you don't have many mods, i'll assume you started with the stock VE table ?

[bluegoat06]

Thanks for you reply.

I remember hearing that people were setting the bias to 1 to move it more toward ECT. What was the final verdict on that? Does that fix the lean startup issue?

I'm about to throw in the towel on this. I suspect my Volant intake is making the car lean on the top end of the rpm range and the trims are adding to my PE when I go WOT. Would it be ok to jack that area of the VE table and let the computer trim it back out again so I don't have positive trims being added to my pe curve?

Don't worry about the Bias.
Where are you in the tune Process, did you start tuning the VE first. ?

Tune VE first, Don't try to tune the entire table, there is no need for that and you would go crazy trying, i don't see any big mods so the stock VE table should be more than enough to start.

Once you're done with the VE, turn your MAF on and enable your trims, then you would startd doing your MAF, when finish, youll go back to CL.

Post your current SD tune, logs and config file.

[ktoonsez]

My understanding is that trims DO affect WOT if your trims are lean. In order to be safe, they add the positive trims to the PE curve. Thus if your in a cell that is +2 when you punch it, you will see 2% more fuel than the commanded PE curve. If the cell is negative trim, nothing is added to the curve. Maybe I'm totally off base here, but my understanding was that this was for safety. That's why I'm thinking I should just jack the table since I can't get enough data in the WOT cells... just let the computer compensate by leaning it out for me with the NB's. Backwoods tuning yes, but it may help keep me from going crazy.

You are right on what the trims are for. Maybe the GTO is different than a corvette, but the Trims immediately go to zero's when I go to WOT because the narrow bands are unreliable at WOT. Maybe someone else here knows different but the trims should be zeroed at WOT on your car as well! Here is the test for that, start at zero MPH, turn on the logging and immediately hit the gas 100% as your RPM's climb you should zeros every in the upper MAP areas.