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Thread: 2.5bar for E38 ECM's features and devtest results

  1. #1

    Arrow 2.5bar for E38 ECM's features and devtest results

    Hi guys,

    Some of you are aware that we have been working on a 2.5bar solution for the E38 ECM's that no longer have a VE table. After a few issues, I completed the last internal devtest session today where finally everything worked as planned on the dyno

    We've incorporated a number of powerful new features that brings the HP Tuners solution well ahead of any stock operating system solution. Here's a quick rundown on the features, some of which will be familiar to those that have used our enhancements before.

    This E38 enhancement contains the following features:
    - 2.5 bar (255 kPa) max MAP sensor support (calibration capability for GM 0-5V linear MAP sensors)
    - Rescaled MAF High Freq table supports up to 15400 Hz with 300 Hz resolution, also supports airflow up to 1024 g/sec(in select operating systems)
    - New VE tables with 33 x 33 cell resolution each and configurable MAP and RPM axes (choose your own resolution)
    - Charge Temperature based VE multiplier table, configurable axis
    - TPS based VE multiplier table, 33 x 17 cells with configurable TPS and RPM axes
    - MAP referenced Boost Enrich table
    - Boost Enrich MAP threshold and hysteresis value
    - Both MAF and Speed Density mode supported
    - Boost based fuel cut, selectable MAP threshold cuts fuel to all cylinders when exceeded
    - Rescaled fan temperature axis 163-250F (73-121C), stock is 192-250F (89-121C)

    The MAF High Freq table has been rescaled to 5800-15400Hz at 300 Hz resolution and the maximum airflow limit for this table has also been adjusted to allow up to 1024 g/sec (instead of the stock 512 g/sec). This is excellent news for boosted applications that want to retain the MAF but reach higher than the stock 12200Hz and 512 g/sec limits.



    There are three new VE tables. Two Normal tables (one for the intake manifold control open and another for closed) and one Displacement On Demand (DoD) VE table. For vehicles that do not have intake manifold control and/or DoD it is a good idea to set all three VE tables the same. There are also VE multiplier tables that can be used to change (multiply) the VE value based on Charge Temperature (Manifold Air Temperature) and TPS/RPM. The TPS Multiplier table can be useful for tuning large camshafts. On various tables the RPM/MAP/TPS axes are fully configurable, you can set the resolution to suit your application. The defaults are suited up to around 10psi boost (175 kPa) with 5 kPa MAP resolution and 200 RPM resolution from 400-6800 RPM.





    Boost enrichment functions as per our other enhancements, with an enable MAP, hysteresis and Boost Enrich table. Boost enrichment also triggers open loop fuelling. The ECM will use the richest of the PE table and the Boost Enrich table values when fuelling.

    The new Boost Fuel Cut feature will cut fuel to all cylinders whenever boost is above the enable MAP value. There is also an enable/disable option for this feature. It is a complete fuel cut to all cylinders when active. This could be used by engine shops who supply turbo chargers with electronic boost controllers to protect against customers winding the boost up higher than the engine internals can handle. It could also be used as a valet tune kind of feature.



    Overall, the devtest results are very promising with the folks looking in on the testing very happy to return to "normal" VE table style tuning, the HUGE tables, the awesome flexibility and customization possible with the configurable axes and also looking forward to the possibilities of extended MAF tuning with exotic MAFs or maybe even the new LS3 MAF. The fan axis lowering is also one that was well received!

    As i mentioned above, at present we will start out with a limited beta for the Aussie VE Holdens with a specific operating system ID (covers most if not all VE's). Assuming the limited beta goes well then after SEMA we will begin the large'ish task of integrating all the E38 and E67 OS's we currently support for the US and other markets. I would like to offer a US beta also initally, but with the many deadlines to meet before SEMA this is the best plan we could make.



    Chris...
    Last edited by Bill@HPTuners; 07-28-2012 at 03:22 PM.
    I count sheep in hex...

  2. #2
    Senior Tuner 5_Liter_Eater's Avatar
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    Man thats huge! Very flexible and extensible. Yet another reason I wish I would have stayed away from the '05 model year. Pesky E40's.

    Excellent work!
    Last edited by 5_Liter_Eater; 10-11-2007 at 08:54 AM.
    Bill Winters

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  3. #3
    HP Tuners Owner Keith@HPTuners's Avatar
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    You E40's already have an HPT 2bar solution..
    We got this guy Not Sure, ...

  4. #4
    Senior Tuner 5_Liter_Eater's Avatar
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    Yea but this is neater.

    I really like the LS3'like MAF table extension and I'm sure other will like seeing actual VE tables.
    Bill Winters

    Former owner/builder/tuner of the FarmVette
    Out of the LSx tuning game

  5. #5
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    Fantastic guys! I don't mind the Aussie beta over the US beta, so long as we get the solution you guys have worked out eventually. Now excuse me while I clean up my keyboard from my drool.

  6. #6
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    way to go! talk about understanding and using the e38 to it's fullest. awesome job.

  7. #7
    Супер Модератор EC_Tune's Avatar
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    Let me start out positive: WOW!!! You guys have really been working overtime. Chris, when do you get your first vacation in 5 years?

    Now the wet towel...
    How does this affect those with the VVT motors?
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  8. #8
    Tuner carneb's Avatar
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    This looks great! No more playing around with excel spreadsheets for VE tuning.

    Do the new VE tables do away with the coefficients completely or are all the calculations done to convert to/from coefficients done in the background?

    If we change the axis headings in the VE table will new VE table cell values be generated based on coefficients?
    VE Calais V 6.0L L98 V8 6L80E

  9. #9
    VE coefficients and associated calculations are gone. The new tables are all real, just like the E40 and the good old LS1 PCM

    In regards to the VVT motors, this is something we will work on before the US beta, i originally planned to add a couple of extra Cam Multiplier tables that will be Multiplier vs. Intake Cam Angle vs. RPM and also Multiplier vs. Exhaust Cam Angle vs. RPM. Although i think tuning it will be beyond most folks, but still a lot easier than trying to picture a 6d chart in your head

    It's kinda surprising but not really surprising that most positive feedback so far has been around the extended MAF table and the aftermarket options and opportunities it opens up for tuners who are only just running out of MAF (on low psi boosted apps or strokers) and don't want to go down the pure SD path for various reasons.

    Chris...
    I count sheep in hex...

  10. #10
    HP Tuners Support
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris@HPTuners
    It's kinda surprising but not really surprising that most positive feedback so far has been around the extended MAF table and the aftermarket options and opportunities it opens up for tuners who are only just running out of MAF (on low psi boosted apps or strokers) and don't want to go down the pure SD path for various reasons.

    Chris...
    Told you using a little GM thinking would go well

    I think an all in 1 custom operating system with the simplicity you've incorporated will be just what the doctor ordered so to speak

    It doesn't have to be perfect, it just needs to be done in two weeks...

    A wise man once said "google it"

  11. #11
    Супер Модератор EC_Tune's Avatar
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    Is the cam angle going to be a scanner item (MPID)? Otherwise it's going to be a bear with the VVT motors.
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  12. #12
    yeah everything you need will be added, even the VVT tables for a start
    I count sheep in hex...

  13. #13
    Супер Модератор EC_Tune's Avatar
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    <raises eyebrows> COOL!
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  14. #14
    yeah my new calibration slave will be very busy after SEMA
    I count sheep in hex...

  15. #15
    Супер Модератор EC_Tune's Avatar
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    I bet!
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  16. #16
    As opposed to reverse calculating the coefficients and constants for a 1 Bar SD(or essentially any Bar SD for that matter within the GM limits) is there any reason why this enhanced OS wouldn't be a viable option on say a cammed N/A using the E38 PCM ie no boost, just meaning you would have a nice very high res 'traditional' VE table. I know the equation method is probably more accurate for fuelling which is why GM have gone this way I assume but just curious more than anything. Old habits die hard I suppose

    Awesome enhancement btw and 2 credits I imagine??
    Last edited by SSUte01; 10-13-2007 at 07:15 PM.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSUte01
    As opposed to reverse calculating the coefficients and constants for a 1 Bar SD(or essentially any Bar SD for that matter within the GM limits) is there any reason why this enhanced OS wouldn't be a viable option on say a cammed N/A using the E38 PCM ie no boost, just meaning you would have a nice very high res 'traditional' VE table. I know the equation method is probably more accurate for fuelling which is why GM have gone this way I assume but just curious more than anything. Old habits die hard I suppose
    Yeah this is going to be an all in one type of custom OS, we basically gave everyone the best of all worlds

    Real VE table
    Real SINGLE MAF table with double the limits
    VE multiplier
    Boost Multiplier
    Lower fan turn on limits
    etc.

    of course the E38/E67's already use both high/low tables even when in SD for spark so thats not a factor.

    This was a huge undertaking and will be over the next few months so we wanted to do it right the first time

    It doesn't have to be perfect, it just needs to be done in two weeks...

    A wise man once said "google it"

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSUte01
    As opposed to reverse calculating the coefficients and constants for a 1 Bar SD(or essentially any Bar SD for that matter within the GM limits) is there any reason why this enhanced OS wouldn't be a viable option on say a cammed N/A using the E38 PCM ie no boost, just meaning you would have a nice very high res 'traditional' VE table. I know the equation method is probably more accurate for fuelling which is why GM have gone this way I assume but just curious more than anything. Old habits die hard I suppose

    Awesome enhancement btw and 2 credits I imagine??
    definaly be a advantage,

    full VE table with 200rpm and 3kpa resoultion ie 32x32, compared to the e40 at 16x16 or the LS1 at 19x20 it will make a huge difference!

    TPS corrections just add to the features etc,

    this will definatly be the way to go with the SD soultion for the E38's

  19. #19
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    Chris,

    any chance of a quick add for the VZ 6L OS's?? got a few boosted ones to do next week

  20. #20
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    Has anyone tried this on a 1-bar setup? We are trying out the beta program (thanks Chris) and having trouble with the AFR Error Histogram, it seems to be running backwards from 200kpa (initial numbers in the top right of the histogram).

    Perhaps we need to be doing something different for the map sensor. We're running the factory map sensor (VE GTS commodore). And we've tried both the LS2 and E38 AFR Error histograms. We've also checked we are running the right linear offset values (factory 1 bar).

    I miust be doing something wrong.