Cant get a steady/stable idle from off idle to approx 1700 rpm, Gen 4 LS3 E38

[edcmat-l1]

I will say it again, If you think you are so smart, tell us all why i have the small hiccup I do??

Funny how you say you wont, when I believe the real truth is you cant or don't know lol

But you keep on talking bud. This is a help forum and you have done nothing to help me so kindly fuck right off.

No one cares about how many cars you think you have tuned. It comes down to your shitty attitude why people dont wanna deal with you.

I remember last time you tried to compare my file you compared it to a Z06 which wasn't even my car. Real professional bud.lol Seems like you really don't have a fucking clue

There are other tuners on here who have guided me through this and recommended I change all the very tables you say I shouldn't have.

People like Ghuggins, Hjturbo, Cringer. They have all been a huge help to me and have netted me positive results for the most part and fixed 90% of my issues, which is more than I can say for you.

All 3 of these guys are miles ahead of you. I've seen you try to correct them as well and guess what? No one pays attention to you lol

I cant wait until we all figure out my small hiccup so I can rub your fn nose in it lol

Learn to read dipshit and stay off my post unless you actually have something useful to post besides your usual shit.

I've seen you pick fights with numerous people on here and I'm the only one with a set of balls that will stand up to your useless BS

You seem to forget my car runs absolutely amazing now in every which way with the exception of this small hiccup which at some point I will solve.

None of this, and I repeat......... none of this was accomplished with your help.

That should speaks volumes, yet you cant find any actual fault with my tune.

Yet here you go spouting off like the retard you really are

You have baked in your own problems. I've said it many times. You've changed shit you don't need to change. You've caused you own problems. It happens all the time. The way to fix it is start over with just the very basic tables required to make it run.

I don't pick fights. People don't like what I have to say sometimes. Just like you. Balls or not you don't know what you're doing and you won't listen to someone who does.

I'll continue to post wherever and whenever I feel like it.

[edcmat-l1]

The point you seem to be missing is, and the reason no one has come in here and told you how to fix your one little hiccup, is because there isn't an easy answer. There's not a table or setting to fix your one little hiccup. It is the culmination of the changes you've made. The only real way to fix it is to undo it completely and start over. Or painstakingly go back one step at a time until it's gone.

Anyone with any knowledge of these things knows you don't need to change half the shit you have. That's just the facts. Sorry you're struggling with that.

[Allen Vos]

You have baked in your own problems. I've said it many times. You've changed shit you don't need to change. You've caused you own problems. It happens all the time. The way to fix it is start over with just the very basic tables required to make it run.

I don't pick fights. People don't like what I have to say sometimes. Just like you. Balls or not you don't know what you're doing and you won't listen to someone who does.

I'll continue to post wherever and whenever I feel like it.

Lol, you were the one that said to put my torque tables back to stock and told me to leave my adaptive spark over and under speed alone about a month or 2 ago.

At first, I took you seriously and listened.

Then I found out you are full of shit because nothing you said worked and started listening to others.

That should have been a clue to you that you don't in fact know what you are talking about.

I modified the MAP side of my torque table to reflect lower torque numbers at idle and modified my throttle follower to suit and guess what??

My idle blip was solved.

I cut my over and under speed values in half and that fixed my over reactive idle . Another thing you said not to do .


It was solved because I listened to the other advanced users on here and not you.

I will also mention that these users took the time to explain things to me so I understood it.

You as a technician should understand that and should even know better, but you don't.

This is exactly why I will not ever take your advice even if you were the last tuner on earth.

You steered me wrong multiple times and why would this time be any different? lol

Lord knows where I would be right now If I had listened to you. lol

See why I laugh when you say put shit back to stock? lol

Must be pretty simple for you to tune a car when you leave everything stock BAHAAAAAA!!!!!!

This issue too will be solved and you will be eating your words.

[Allen Vos]

Well. First is to quit picking a fight with a guy trying to help, even though Ed can be a little "straight forward", lol. I can't remember your set-up but is it more or less a Stock longblock with a cam? Id say dial in your MAF, VVE, like really dial it in with a ton of filters. Once you are absolutely confident in your fueling, then dive into timing a little bit. Now this is what is different about most veteran tuners vs OEM, you can start messing with the VTT APC side to get your idle torque to something more realistic, ie 5-40 Ftlbs. IF, you still have issues with rev and return to idle, then you start to adjust throttle follower, whether it be you increase the torque values, but also reduce the step values. Disabling spark smoothing is pretty common practice also.

Sidenote: When you make a change, post the new tune along with the corresponding log, then someone can try to help a little better.
Sidenote 2: Fueling adjustments for the Idle cells of the VVE are skewed while the vehicle is at idle, in other words try to dial your trims while under load while hitting those cells, not in park/neutral.

Thank you for taking the time to respond. First of all Ed is not trying to help me whatsoever, im sure you can now see that by this post. He gives out horrible information and has time and time again. Check out my previous posts with him. He doesn't offer any help besides preaches to put shit back to stock.

I can promise you If someone was actually trying to help I would never pick a fight with them. I'm the kind of guy that don't put up with other peoples lies and BS.

Any ways , enough about this, its getting old , lol

As far as my setup goes, its an 09 vette, LS3 6 speed manual with 1 7/8 long tubes , catless X pipe and CAI.

Cam is a TSP stage 2 which is somewhere in between a mild camshaft and a super rowdy race camshaft. I don't have the specs here right now but its pretty much the limit for a street driven cam though

To answer what you replied with , I have got fuel dialed in very very close and used cringers methods with the filters and got the fuel trims within a few percent.

Timing has been taken care of, SOIT/EOIT as well.

I had some help with VTT and as you said I only touched the MAP side and dialed it in for approx. 5-6 ft ft/lbs at idle.

I found doing this greatly reduced any idle and idle recovery/return to idle issues.

Throttle Follower has been set to a wee bit less than the idle torque at idle .

Its interesting what you are saying about the idle tuning being skewed with no load. I did find it a bit finicky to get the idle dialed in which makes sense now based on what you are saying. It would be easy to set the idle fueling with an automatic but what would you recommend doing with a manual transmission when you cant put the load on it like that?

Honestly the car runs great. There is only this small issue to sort out.

Im not sure if you have read my initial post but the issue is that the PCM is bouncing between idle and pedal mode while stepping on the throttle a little bit.

You can see adaptive spark is pulling timing when its in idle mode.

So my issue is how do you stop it from going into idle mode or speed control mode while you are on the accelerator pedal?

Its a very minor issue and is really only noticeable in neutral with no load. Once you start driving the car its not an issue.

I could prolly just leave it, but my OCD wont let me lol

[edcmat-l1]

Lol, you were the one that said to put my torque tables back to stock and told me to leave my adaptive spark over and under speed alone about a month or 2 ago.

At first, I took you seriously and listened.

Then I found out you are full of shit because nothing you said worked and started listening to others.

That should have been a clue to you that you don't in fact know what you are talking about.

I modified the MAP side of my torque table to reflect lower torque numbers at idle and modified my throttle follower to suit and guess what??

My idle blip was solved.

I cut my over and under speed values in half and that fixed my over reactive idle . Another thing you said not to do .


It was solved because I listened to the other advanced users on here and not you.

I will also mention that these users took the time to explain things to me so I understood it.

You as a technician should understand that and should even know better, but you don't.

This is exactly why I will not ever take your advice even if you were the last tuner on earth.

You steered me wrong multiple times and why would this time be any different? lol

Lord knows where I would be right now If I had listened to you. lol

See why I laugh when you say put shit back to stock? lol

Must be pretty simple for you to tune a car when you leave everything stock BAHAAAAAA!!!!!!

This issue too will be solved and you will be eating your words.

I'll say it again. There's no reason to change your torque tables in your vehicle.

MAF/VE/BRAF and your car would run near perfect. Those three tables alone. Does that mean it's a complete tune? Not exactly but the point is it would run fine and would not have that weird off idle issue you're having now.

Spark over/under tables are more of a feel type thing. You can leave them stock which gives you the most spark control or loosen them up a little to make it feel better. But if you go too far you lose some idle control.

Not sure why you can't wrap your head around that. More is not better.

ANY time you get into a situation like this, odd driveability issue, can't really pin it down, the best thing to do is start over.

I'm not being a jerk about it, I'm telling you how it is.

[Allen Vos]

I'll say it again. There's no reason to change your torque tables in your vehicle.

MAF/VE/BRAF and your car would run near perfect. Those three tables alone. Does that mean it's a complete tune? Not exactly but the point is it would run fine and would not have that weird off idle issue you're having now.

Spark over/under tables are more of a feel type thing. You can leave them stock which gives you the most spark control or loosen them up a little to make it feel better. But if you go too far you lose some idle control.

Not sure why you can't wrap your head around that. More is not better.

ANY time you get into a situation like this, odd driveability issue, can't really pin it down, the best thing to do is start over.

I'm not being a jerk about it, I'm telling you how it is.

Sorry, not going to listen to you ever again. You would do well to pay attention to the discussions going on here with torque modeling

I can tell you first hand that changing my torque tables fixed some of my issues that you said to put back to stock, just as you are claiming yet again

You were wrong back then and you are wrong again.

So I completely disagree with you here and so do some of the more advanced users on this site.

Also remember you telling me to leave the adaptive spark settings alone too.

Funny thing is I listened to you way back when and literally put all my tables back to stcok with the excpetion of MAF /VE and BRAF and it did not run very well at all.

So the moral of this story is, I dont really care who you are or what you know, you have not proved credible in my eyes and will never listen to you.

Im tired of going down your rabbit holes.

NEVER AGAIN

[edcmat-l1]

Sorry, not going to listen to you ever again. You would do well to pay attention to the discussions going on here with torque modeling

I can tell you first hand that changing my torque tables fixed some of my issues that you said to put back to stock, just as you are claiming yet again

You were wrong back then and you are wrong again.

So I completely disagree with you here and so do some of the more advanced users on this site.

Also remember you telling me to leave the adaptive spark settings alone too.

Funny thing is I listened to you way back when and literally put all my tables back to stcok with the excpetion of MAF /VE and BRAF and it did not run very well at all.

So the moral of this story is, I dont really care who you are or what you know, you have not proved credible in my eyes and will never listen to you.

Im tired of going down your rabbit holes.

NEVER AGAIN

Torque modeling means diddly squat on these cars. This isn't a GEN5. Nice try. You have no idea what you're talking about. Chances are that's what's caused this problem.

[Allen Vos]

Torque modeling means diddly squat on these cars. This isn't a GEN5. Nice try. You have no idea what you're talking about. Chances are that's what's caused this problem.

Lol, you just keep on digging that hole your in

It sounds like you need to brush up on your tuning as the idle is definitely affected on a gen 4 with torque tables.

That's exactly how I brought them back in line with the help of Ghuggins and HJturbo.

Maybe you can tell them they don't know what they are talking about either. lol

It fixed my idle blip and made the car run that much better.

If you actually look into into it, gen 4 is torque based around the idle and also needs to be set correctly if you want to use traction control

Some people will argue that the Air mass torque tables on a gen 4 are necessary for adding extra line pressure on automatics but I'm not really up on that as mine is a manual.


Now gen 5 is 100% torque based and we all know that.

I don't know how much more clearer I can be when I say I did the opposite of what you said and my issues were fixed.

You cant really argue with that, no matter how smart you think you are.

If you had actually read my posts you would see that I did in fact put my torque tables and throttle body follower back to stock to see if that was the issue. It most certainly was not. Modding torque tables has done more good than bad for me.

Sorry Ed, but your not a god around here as you think and feel you are.

Maybe its time for you to retire and put yourself out to pasture along with your old fashioned ways.

[biholliday]

tried turning your max vss up?

[obthomas]

This entire thread reminds me of rolling in the mud with a pig. Suddenly you realize the pig likes it.

[edcmat-l1]

Lol, you just keep on digging that hole your in

It sounds like you need to brush up on your tuning as the idle is definitely affected on a gen 4 with torque tables.

That's exactly how I brought them back in line with the help of Ghuggins and HJturbo.

Maybe you can tell them they don't know what they are talking about either. lol

It fixed my idle blip and made the car run that much better.

If you actually look into into it, gen 4 is torque based around the idle and also needs to be set correctly if you want to use traction control

Some people will argue that the Air mass torque tables on a gen 4 are necessary for adding extra line pressure on automatics but I'm not really up on that as mine is a manual.


Now gen 5 is 100% torque based and we all know that.

I don't know how much more clearer I can be when I say I did the opposite of what you said and my issues were fixed.

You cant really argue with that, no matter how smart you think you are.

If you had actually read my posts you would see that I did in fact put my torque tables and throttle body follower back to stock to see if that was the issue. It most certainly was not. Modding torque tables has done more good than bad for me.

Sorry Ed, but your not a god around here as you think and feel you are.

Maybe its time for you to retire and put yourself out to pasture along with your old fashioned ways.

It's hysterical you actually think you know something I don't. Like, after not even one car, that you've yet to iron out, you're going to tell me what I don't know. That's something only a fool would do.

G8 1500 RPM.jpg

CTSV 1500 RPM.jpg

Here are 2 E67s I was working on Friday via email. Did not see, hear, touch either one. One is a mildly modded G8 the other is a heavily modded CTSV. Neither one have the issue you're dealing with.

If you know so much about tuning you'll know the E67 and E38 are nearly identical in function, layout, etc. For comparison sake, in this instance, they'll do.

I don't think or care if I'm a "god" anywhere. I've had a great career. I've tuned thousands of cars. I have a very high success rate and very low failure rate. I'm good at what I do and I know what I'm talking about.

The fact that a complete novice is going to talk to me the way you do clearly shows just how dumb you are. It's like a kindergartener heckling a tenured professor. Or an infant telling an adult they're dumb. It's over the top idiocy.

[edcmat-l1]

Maybe its time for you to retire and put yourself out to pasture along with your old fashioned ways.

I had to come back and just focus on this one comment. You realize you're the one with the car with a problem, and I'm the one who's tuned thousands of them that don't do that, right? This one comment has to be your dumbest.

You do realize my old fashioned ways are the same basic ways everyone else on here preaches, right? Accurate airflow modeling, correct injector data? You know, calibrations that make mathematical sense?

Please tell me how superior your knowledge is that I need to retire mine. We're all waiting.

4 weeks ago you couldn't even tune a VVE. Yours looked like a combo of the rockies and the grand canyon. Now you're such an x-spert you're gonna heckle me.

Your current issue is self-induced. My cars don't do that. Ever.

[edcmat-l1]

And I'd like to add, besides us going back and forth, no one has really replied to this thread with any legit advice how to fix this. I wonder why? There's a lot of smart guys on here that's for sure. You'd think if someone knew, had the majik bullet, instafix, they'd post it. Now, it could be your magnetic personality that's deterring them. Couldn't blame them. But I'd bet it's more like what I'm saying, and that it's an oddball, self-inflicted problem that's most likely from a combination of changes and there just isn't a majik bullet fix.

[Allen Vos]

And I'd like to add, besides us going back and forth, no one has really replied to this thread with any legit advice how to fix this. I wonder why? There's a lot of smart guys on here that's for sure. You'd think if someone knew, had the majik bullet, instafix, they'd post it. Now, it could be your magnetic personality that's deterring them. Couldn't blame them. But I'd bet it's more like what I'm saying, and that it's an oddball, self-inflicted problem that's most likely from a combination of changes and there just isn't a majik bullet fix.

Ed, I don't really give a fuck what you have to say, You only come on here to put other people down. I never ever said I was an expert on this stuff, nor have I ever implied that.

If I was I most certainly would not be coming on here looking for advice.

Yet here you are twisting everything around like the narrasist you are.

I will say it again, your advice has had me chasing my tail in circles and has caused me nothing but grief


Nothing you said has worked for me, yet here you are trying to trash my abilities. I fail to see why anyone would listen to you ever.

Despite you trashing my tune, the car runs great and only has a couple little hiccups.

If I'm such a failure as you would have everyone believe, I don't believe the car would not be running as well as it is.


There are others on here who have helped me out and I'm very appreciative for that.

Your nothing but an idiot who wants everyone's attention and that's so obvious by many of your other posts.

You have still to this day, despite all your talk, proven anything that's wrong with my tune and I think everyone needs to wrap their head around that. lol

I'm done wasting time with you and don't really give a rats ass about you or what you think.

I will figure this out without your so called expertise. This isn't the only site that offers help on Gen 4 tuning.

Maybe if your a so called expert and If you actually put the same effort into helping people as you do being a dick on here, you might not be so useless on here.

[Allen Vos]

This entire thread reminds me of rolling in the mud with a pig. Suddenly you realize the pig likes it.

Did you come to roll in the mud too? LOL

[Allen Vos]

tried turning your max vss up?

No, I am fairly confident my issue lies with with the ETC and the transition between idle/pedal mode.

My ETC scaler settings are all stock within this respect, but I have been researching this topic and when I get some more time, I will dig into this a bit more.

My Accel pedal signal show some electrical noise on the signal within VCM Scanner, so it may be something as dumb as a bad accelerator pedal causing my issues.

I'm going to scope it when I get a chance and prolly start a new thread to get away from this nonsense.

[edcmat-l1]

Ed, I don't really give a fuck what you have to say, You only come on here to put other people down. I never ever said I was an expert on this stuff, nor have I ever implied that.

If I was I most certainly would not be coming on here looking for advice.

Yet here you are twisting everything around like the narrasist you are.

I will say it again, your advice has had me chasing my tail in circles and has caused me nothing but grief


Nothing you said has worked for me, yet here you are trying to trash my abilities. I fail to see why anyone would listen to you ever.

Despite you trashing my tune, the car runs great and only has a couple little hiccups.

If I'm such a failure as you would have everyone believe, I don't believe the car would not be running as well as it is.


There are others on here who have helped me out and I'm very appreciative for that.

Your nothing but an idiot who wants everyone's attention and that's so obvious by many of your other posts.

You have still to this day, despite all your talk, proven anything that's wrong with my tune and I think everyone needs to wrap their head around that. lol

I'm done wasting time with you and don't really give a rats ass about you or what you think.

I will figure this out without your so called expertise. This isn't the only site that offers help on Gen 4 tuning.

Maybe if your a so called expert and If you actually put the same effort into helping people as you do being a dick on here, you might not be so useless on here.

You're trying to insist it is not your doing. Your tune is perfect. I can't point out anything in particular that's wrong. I posted 3 screen shots of all the changes you made, to a mild cammed C6. You don't know enough about what you're doing to know if your tune file is correct or not. That's pretty much the end of the story.

There's nothing to scope. There's no problem with your ETC. It's in the changes you made to the calibration. You need to put it all back to stock and start over.

[Allen Vos]

You're trying to insist it is not your doing. Your tune is perfect. I can't point out anything in particular that's wrong. I posted 3 screen shots of all the changes you made, to a mild cammed C6. You don't know enough about what you're doing to know if your tune file is correct or not. That's pretty much the end of the story.

There's nothing to scope. There's no problem with your ETC. It's in the changes you made to the calibration. You need to put it all back to stock and start over.

Blah Blah Blah Blah.

You were dread wrong about the torque tables needing to be stock so I can only assume your wrong about this.

Burn me once, I will never listen to you. END OF STORY!!!

So you'll never get a chance to give me advice again.

Ill figure this out on my own before I take your advice.

Ill even take advice from a newbie on here over you lol

Ghuggins ,Hjturbo and others taught me that and I could see the difference in how the engine ran once I followed their instructions.

Maybe you should just tell them they are wrong too lol

Both those guys are miles ahead of you and don't pull the BS you pull on here.

So again, if your not going to help, Just fuck off.

I haven't got time for your nonsense.