Throttle "blip" or flare when I release the throttle while cruising - 6.2 Raptor

[Pistol_91]

Channels
Knock retard... + is bad - is good
Knock correction... + is good - is bad.
So yes you're right.

[trick76cj5]

Ok, I need a sanity check here. And sorry I'm such a Newb and am probably asking really dumb questions at this point.

1) MAF Looks to be pretty close:
LTFT.jpg

Is this an accurate assessment?

2) Transfer delay was increased 20% per the murfie's recommended starting point in the post Sirius provided (i had read that previously, but it didn't make as much sense the first time I read it, it makes more sense now. But, I'm not sure what I'm looking for now. They both "overshoot" the commanded line, so i am supposed to keep decreasing this number until they don't overshoot, and then go back a step?

Also, my bank 1 and bank 2 are nearly 180* out of phase at some points (circled in red), is this a concern or is it normal?
Transfer Delay.jpg

3) Knock retard. I understand what you are saying about a safe tune, i also now understand about limiting the total timing the truck can add. Based on that, when the knock retard goes negative and the slope is negative, the truck is adding timing because it hasn't sensed knock . ..but when the slop changes to flat or positive, has it made that change because it has sensed knock and is therefore pulling timing back out? I think this is what i missed about your prior comment, and why i should limit the amount of timing the truck will add so i never knock.

So, i ran with the timing in Sirius's tune and hit some timing retard. Is the goal then to go into those tables at that load/rpm and reduce the timing by that amount, or what is the best method to address this (time stamp 6:32:21)
Knock Retard.jpg

Anything else you see in my log that stands out please let me know.

Again, thanks everyone for taking the time to help me with this! I know downloading the attachments, opening, digging through someone else's formatting and tune files takes a significant amount of time and effort.

316pm2.hpl
V2_Mod1.hpt

[SiriusC1024]

In your original log, this is too much KR. 8 degrees at the cursor, 4 at the other two peaks.
KR.png

In your latest log there's even more KR. Stock 6.2 is 9.8:1, but you're now 11:1. Higher compression will necessitate less spark advance. Are you running premium fuel?

[trick76cj5]

Sorry, i should have clarified, I reset SD, TM, and Timing back to stock values, and used your settings for everything else (except the MAF period which i retained and the delay time for the O2 sensor), and this is a fresh start at the tune. My prior tune had less timing than stock in a lot of areas, but more in others, so i figured i should just start from square 1 and not over-think things. You also confirmed that my logic is sound in my understanding of how i am reading timing.

Yes, i'm running premium fuel. Ultimately, i would like to run flex fuel once i get this tune dialed in, but i need to be 100% sure I understand how all of this works together to make a solid tune.

So, my next step is to pull timing. Should i only pull timing from the area where i've experienced knock, or is the better approach to pull it across the whole table?

Edit - And sorry, i'm not really asking you to hold my hand through this whole process, i've written over 50 tunes at this point on my journey, i've learned a lot . . . mostly what doesnt work. I've learned a lot, but just haven't connected some of the dots. I don't want to try to explain to the experts my thought process and how i got there, so i am working through trying to learn the process you would take, this will help my see where i went awry in my own process . I'm not at all trying to be lazy, i just don't want to annoy everyone with me explaining what i think i know while it clearly has not lead me to a proper ending point . . . so i really don't know :-D

[Pistol_91]

Just subtract timing where you're experiencing detonation. No reason to pull it in other areas.

[SiriusC1024]

The thing to do might be to remap the Best Fuel Economy distance table to rely less on MP3 and MP4. Those angles are for EGR effect where exhaust is drawn back into the cylinder. Inert gas displacing oxygen, therefore fuel economy. Now that you have longtubes pulling air/fuel charge in things are different. Just a thought.

distance tables.png

[trick76cj5]

The thing to do might be to remap the Best Fuel Economy distance table to rely less on MP3 and MP4. Those angles are for EGR effect where exhaust is drawn back into the cylinder. Inert gas displacing oxygen, therefore fuel economy. Now that you have longtubes pulling air/fuel charge in things are different. Just a thought.

distance tables.png

Sirius, thanks for the clarification on the distance tables. I knew some of those were for driving EGR, but hadn't gotten to the point of understanding exactly the impact of the cam timing at each rpm/load range. This helps fill in some of the gaps as well.

[trick76cj5]

I've made the suggested changes to the distance tables.

I've pulled timing from the areas that showed knock. Knock is now way down, but i have a few more areas to clean up.

I changed my transport delay to 18% over stock (last file was 20% over stock). The chart shows much less oscillation above/below commanded, will try 22% on my next tune. I'm hoping something will stand out on this to show me what i'm looking for.

Couple comments:
1) I did a WOT run that took a downshift into 2nd and then ran through 3rd for a little while. Couldn't get a clear set of road to do a good 3rd gear pull . . .nor would the wife let me. But i didn't get any fuel enrichment, should have run to 0.82 commanded on that run, but it stayed at 1.

2) During that same run, it came out of OP distance table which i didn't think should happen as i believe i was hitting both the throttle and load requirements for OP.

3) Also during this event, i was on trans truncation . .. this is likely the reason for issue 1 and 2, but I can't figure out what limit i was hitting. Easy button is to turn torque truncation off, but curious if you guys see what limit i was exceeding. I expected the truncation during the shift, but it held truncation all the way through 2nd and 3rd.

Also, let me know if you see anything else weird, or if any of my above comments are incorrect. I'll get a chance to load 1 more tune this weekend, but then i fly out of town mon-wed this week so tuning will get put on hold.

317pm2.hpl
V2_Mod2.hpt

[engineermike]

2) Looks like it was slow getting into OP but it stayed once in. I think logging rate might have something to do with that appearance.

3) Check out tables 40069 and 40070. This might explain why the torque source is trans truncation.

[trick76cj5]

2) Looks like it was slow getting into OP but it stayed once in. I think logging rate might have something to do with that appearance.

3) Check out tables 40069 and 40070. This might explain why the torque source is trans truncation.

Got it! I'll check the logging rate on those, i thought they were set as high as they could go . . . maybe i have too many channels logging at a high rate, how would I know if i'm asking for more data than can be provided?

40069 for the TCC was set to 410 and 450, so that was probably it. 40070 was set at 810 for everything except for reverse and neutral. I will adjust 40069 up and see if that fixes it.

I'm working on my spark tables right now, after i get them dialed w/o any knock i'll report back, it will be the end of the week because i fly out tomorrow and won't be able to do any test and tune.

Thanks again everyone for all the support!

[SiriusC1024]

One problem I see is it never goes into PE.

[trick76cj5]

Spent a lot of time adjusting the tune to remove the knock retard from the log. I have these weird "tip in" knock events, this is taken at time stamp 5:46.4, do i just need to pull 5* from this point in the timing table for this MP, or is there a "tip in" retard function that i'm missing?

knock.png


Other than that, the knock is under control. I have set that knock advance to 0* so it can't add any timing, i was getting some feeling like the power was inconsistent as i accelerated and held a fixed speed on the interstate so i was thinking if it wasn't modifying timing maybe it would smooth out. That didn't fix it, so if anyone sees what would drive that I would be interested in learning.

Also, at time stamp 28:52.412 i was accelerating from a stop after a cruise on the interstate, i was crossing traffic so going to lean into it to clear the lane, and teh truck hesitated really bad. It looks to me like it swung lean and the throttle body didn't open until the AFR had recovered. Is this an accurate assessment? Is there a "tip in" fuel enrichment I need to look to adjust?

Hesitation.png

Log and tune attached, stock file attached for quicker reference to the tables that were modified (in case i messed something obscure up :-D )

Thanks everyone for all the time and effort, the truck is starting to run really well . . . if i can get these last few things sorted it will be a very solid running truck!

327pm.hpl
V2_Mod17.hpt
Stock_Tune_File.hpt

[SiriusC1024]

Spent a lot of time adjusting the tune to remove the knock retard from the log. I have these weird "tip in" knock events, this is taken at time stamp 5:46.4, do i just need to pull 5* from this point in the timing table for this MP, or is there a "tip in" retard function that i'm missing?

It's at Spark>Advance>Transient>Tip-In lol.

[trick76cj5]

It's at Spark>Advance>Transient>Tip-In lol.

10-4, i saw that and adjusted it but couldn't tell if it did anything. How does the ECU determine a tip-in event? Is there a rate of change for the throttle that is the "trigger" for a tip-in event?

[SiriusC1024]

The airmass qualification under that setting. I'd just disable it.