10R80 Select Shift in Sport Mode

[Ethan5.019]

I am working on my 2019 Mustang GT shift schedules. I want to be able to put the car in Sport mode and downshift with the paddles but once I go WOT I want the car to shift around 7800 rpms without me hitting the paddles. I also have an issue with regular Sport mode that the car won't shift up after a pull but instead wants to downshift and its even more aggressive if you tap the brakes. I believe its my Coast Down map but I haven't changed anything yet to test it.

Any insight on the upshifts in Select Shift mode?

[engineermike]

Selectshift sport can be made to upshift at wot using 2 settings. One is ecm 21567, just set it where you want it to shift. The other is ecm 6512, which needs to be under 100%.

The other issue is called upshift backout, which actually works pretty well for something like road course driving. But it can be turned off using ecm 4241 or modified to work differently using other tables in that area.

[Ethan5.019]

Selectshift sport can be made to upshift at wot using 2 settings. One is ecm 21567, just set it where you want it to shift. The other is ecm 6512, which needs to be under 100%.

The other issue is called upshift backout, which actually works pretty well for something like road course driving. But it can be turned off using ecm 4241 or modified to work differently using other tables in that area.

Hey, thanks for the information! I was able to change a couple of those tables and get the logic to work pretty well. I would like to possibly pick your brain about restructuring the Backout Characteristics and have a better idea of what the coast down maps do and if they have any relation. I was just wondering because Base or Normal mode doesn't have the downshifting aggressiveness that Sport does. I also would like to know how to play with the harshness of my 3-2 and 2-1 shift in Sport mode as well since its quite a bit more jerky and jolting.

Thank you for your help.

[engineermike]

I don’t think the coastdown maps are related to upshift backout. Upshift backout is either activated or it isn’t.

There are 4 different backout maps possible, similar to shift characters. Looks like 0 and 2 aren’t used stock, and 2 is the most aggressive of the bunch. 1 is used for normal and 3 is used for drag and sport. The easiest thing to do is to use the ones that are already defined. For the least aggressive try 0. Then
It’s 1, 3, then 2 in order of aggressiveness.

[Ethan5.019]

So I did change the Backout Config 4241 Sport/Track to the same character as Normal which is 1 and the behavior is still the same with the downshifting from 7 to 6 to 5 pretty rapidly even when lightly braking. I thought that change would cause it to behave like Normal mode downshifting but it did not.

[engineermike]

I think you might be mixing up shift character with up shift backout.

[Ethan5.019]

This is the Backout Config 4241 you mentioned and changing the Sport/Track to the same character as Normal should in theory make them behave the same correct?






Screenshot (21).png

[engineermike]

No, it will only make them behave the same if upshift backout is active. During normal coastdown and part throttle downshifts, the upshift backout is inactive and makes no difference.

[Ethan5.019]

Alright, I'm following again. In order for me to get the Sport mode to downshift like Normal mode I can change the Downshift map and Coast down a little closer to the Base tables and see what that does.

[engineermike]

Yes exactly. Shift character too. Then they should act essentially the same save a few obscure differences like what the paddles do.

[Ethan5.019]

So I've attached my current file and a log I took this morning and I'd just like you to look over it. My 2-3 shift is a little short of what my WOT Select Shift is set for but could that be caused by my Sport Mode upshift map having a lower OSS value in the 100% row for that specific shift? I know there's a degree or so of knock during the pull at the end of the log but I will address that to determine if it is false. Thank you again.




2019 Ford Mustang GT base tune.17.hpt

file17 trans log.hpl

[engineermike]

The shift points are specified in a couple of places and it will use the lowest one.

[TransGo Robert]

So I've attached my current file and a log I took this morning and I'd just like you to look over it. My 2-3 shift is a little short of what my WOT Select Shift is set for but could that be caused by my Sport Mode upshift map having a lower OSS value in the 100% row for that specific shift?

Please note that i know nothing about this stuff, just trying to learn the tuning side (I know the transmsision side of things) but I noticed that your WOT shifts seem to be perfectly in line with the "Select Shift" table under WOT Shift Map. Could it be as easy as raising the 2-3 on that table to get it to shift when you want it too?

SS.png
2-3.png

[Ethan5.019]

Please note that i know nothing about this stuff, just trying to learn the tuning side (I know the transmsision side of things) but I noticed that your WOT shifts seem to be perfectly in line with the "Select Shift" table under WOT Shift Map. Could it be as easy as raising the 2-3 on that table to get it to shift when you want it too?


I thought I had changed my OSS values to around 7400 rpm but it short shifted at around 7k. I used a conversion table to watch the OSS translate to rpm to get my desired points.
SS.png
2-3.png

[Ethan5.019]

The shift points are specified in a couple of places and it will use the lowest one.

So I'm on the right path of thinking that their is another table(s) of values causing it to defer to something other than the WOT Shift Map in Select shift mode. I previously did a log but it was started in 3rd gear and it didn't short shift or anything of the sort that why I was a bit confused.

[TransGo Robert]

I thought I had changed my OSS values to around 7400 rpm but it short shifted at around 7k. I used a conversion table to watch the OSS translate to rpm to get my desired points.

Again keep in mind that I am only somewhat guessing here, it is the first time in my life I look at any of this specific stuff. However if you look at the OSS RPM when the shift is completed (when the input shaft speed is done dropping) you will see that it matches perfectly what you have in that table. It seems to me that whatever number you put in there, the computer is aiming to get there once the shift is completed, it does not seem to be the RPM when the shift is commanded. It seems to be predicting what will happen and therefore commands the shift sooner then what you put in there. It affects the 2-3 much more than the 3-4 since the torque change is different for the two shift which affect greatly how much converter slip you get during the shift. If your math was relating to the turbine shaft RPM or if the converter was locked it would be much more consistent. If it was me I would just bump the 2-3 up a bit to get it where you want it to be engine RPM wise.

[engineermike]

The wot shift map for select shift is ONLY active when in selectshift Sport mode. In live-in-drive mode (paddle shift in drive) it uses the base/normal/drive shift maps.

[Duraj033]

I am working on my 2019 Mustang GT shift schedules. I want to be able to put the car in Sport mode and downshift with the paddles but once I go WOT I want the car to shift around 7800 rpms without me hitting the paddles. I also have an issue with regular Sport mode that the car won't shift up after a pull but instead wants to downshift and its even more aggressive if you tap the brakes. I believe its my Coast Down map but I haven't changed anything yet to test it.

Any insight on the upshifts in Select Shift mode?

[Duraj033]

I?m trying to figure out I can make my 2018 mustang GT 10r80 shift on it?s own in sports mode when I drop it down to gear and I go WOT

[engineermike]

See post #2