late e38 1000cc inj running way rich, need direction

[pcmcobra]

ly6
btr stage 3 cam
lsa blower
1000cc injectors, bosch, using fic data per vendor
Tuner guy got it cranking and running, been through 2 sets of spark plugs. Running way too rich. I'm not a tuner, but have been doing some research to try and help get this thing running. Attaching the tune file and a log. Spent a few hours today had tuner remote in and we have not gotten any improvement.
Just need some advice on the tune and see if anything is way off and a direction.
thx

[5FDP]

What pressure do they rate those 1000cc at?

I ask because 1000cc is equal to about 95lb/hr injectors. You have the 400kpa area of the injector flow rate at 115lb/hr, so it's a pretty big difference in flow rate here.


Did you choose not to run the LSA MAP sensor for some reason? The tune still has the 1 bar MAP data in it.

[pcmcobra]

I will check over that. I am using the lsa map sensor. Thanks for the insight. Will report back

[pcmcobra]

ok, think I uploaded wrong tune. I need to get a little more organized.
Here is correct one, with some logs from yesterday. This is after I added correct injector data. It cranked and would run and idle for about a minute. Then would die.
The tuner remoted in today, he messed around with some stuff. I changed plugs, it would run, but like posted before, pig rich...This tune has the correct map sensor data. And was what we used today, although he changed some stuff during the day.
Sorry for the confusion. Have the pressure set at 58, he asked me to turn it down to about 50. There was no change, still really rich. Plugs were soot black. Will throw in another set.
I know I'm in way over my head, the tuner is doing his best but...I'm just trying to help and learn what I can so I can at least have an idea.
Thx for any advice

[blindsquirrel]

Dude. The column axis labels on that injector flow rate table. How is that even possible. Maybe more important, why? My brain hurts. I just... I mean, axis labels there are not editable. And, it's not changed by any significant amount, it's just changed to... something different.

[blindsquirrel]

If you're making changes and the results don't make any sense, and you have mix-n-match injector data, I think I'd start there.

What 1000cc Bosch injectors? What part number? From where/who? Are they modified injectors? What's the basis for the idea that it's OK to use data from a different injector?

[HartRod]

If you're making changes and the results don't make any sense, and you have mix-n-match injector data, I think I'd start there.

What 1000cc Bosch injectors? What part number? From where/who? Are they modified injectors? What's the basis for the idea that it's OK to use data from a different injector?

Hey BlindSquirrel, I'm a good friend of PCMCobras. Here's a link to the injector data: HP TUNERS Injector data for 1000cc for short body injectors (fuelinjectorclinic.com)

Just to add a little more information about the setup. The truck was running and driving with the 6.0 prior to adding the LSA. A Boyds tank with dual fuel pumps and a Vaporworxs PWM controller was also added.

PressureWorx ZL1/Universal PWM Fuel Module Controller - VaporWorx

[blindsquirrel]

So the FIC 1000 is not a FIC injector, it's simply a rebadged stock Bosch part?

Is the fuel system in constant pressure or referenced mode?

What MAF and intake tube size? Since the MAF table is like 1/4 of the stock LY6 tune it's either a freakin' giant tube and/or a non-LY6 MAF. Tune is in MAF-only.

[HartRod]

So the FIC 1000 is not a FIC injector, it's simply a rebadged stock Bosch part?

Is the fuel system in constant pressure or referenced mode?

What MAF and intake tube size? Since the MAF table is like 1/4 of the stock LY6 tune it's either a freakin' giant tube and/or a non-LY6 MAF. Tune is in MAF-only.

Referenced mode. 4" Tube. Stock LS3 MAF.

[pcmcobra]

Rebadged bosch, don't have the pn handy right now. But they are supposed to be flow matched. Bought them from lance draeger @ r and d performance. He said to use the FIC data.
the system runs referenced via the vaporworx dual pump system. I used ls3 maf and a 4" intake tube.
squirrel, you sound kind of irritated buddy. I'm not here for free tunes, just some help.

[blindsquirrel]

Injector data in the most recent file posted is set up for a non-referenced system. For a referenced system where rail pressure changes 1:1 with manifold pressure, the Injector Flow Rate table needs to be one single value (the one that matches the datasheet at whatever base pressure is) all the way across, and Offset vs Press vs IGNV needs to have every column filled with the single column from the datasheet that matches the base pressure.

I still don't know how those nonstandard axis labels got into that file. Somebody did something that can't be done in HP Tuners. That makes me question what was used to do it, and what the reasoning behind it was, because it makes zero sense to me. No other late Gen 4 file is like that, they are 128kPa to 768kPa, not 128 to 736.

I can stop replying if you don't find any of this helpful. You can just ask straight out, I promise I won't be offended.

[Alvin]

Try this for the rich start. It might not fix everything. There are a lot of areas that need to be cleaned up. But this will help.


opcfirst tune edited 1.2.hpt

[HartRod]

Injector data in the most recent file posted is set up for a non-referenced system. For a referenced system where rail pressure changes 1:1 with manifold pressure, the Injector Flow Rate table needs to be one single value (the one that matches the datasheet at whatever base pressure is) all the way across, and Offset vs Press vs IGNV needs to have every column filled with the single column from the datasheet that matches the base pressure.

I still don't know how those nonstandard axis labels got into that file. Somebody did something that can't be done in HP Tuners. That makes me question what was used to do it, and what the reasoning behind it was, because it makes zero sense to me. No other late Gen 4 file is like that, they are 128kPa to 768kPa, not 128 to 736.

I can stop replying if you don't find any of this helpful. You can just ask straight out, I promise I won't be offended.

Try this for the rich start. It might not fix everything. There are a lot of areas that need to be cleaned up. But this will help.


opcfirst tune edited 1.2.hpt

Thanks guys, we appreciate all the help we can get as this type of stuff is not our day job. This is a retro install in an 86 C10, so it has been a pretty involved swap taking well over a year to complete (we also did a QA1 front and rear suspension upgrade). We are pretty good at the swapping (will post pictures later), but we still need to work on learning the tuning side better. We've tried to get local help and remote help, but so far that has been a disaster and a waste of money (as you can tell with the posted tune). We have no problem paying for help (good money has already been spent for basically nothing). But as you both know, there are a lot of people out there calling themselves tuners (and taking people's money), but have no idea what they are doing. Thanks again and please be patient as we try to figure this out.

HR

[blindsquirrel]

opcfirst tune edited 1.2 referenced injector data 50 PSI base.hpt

If the base pressure is changed in the future, tables 12307 & 12308 need to be changed to match. (current 50psi base = data taken from 344kPa column in the datasheet)

[pcmcobra]

Thank you for the help. I will put some effort into it this weekend. Been out of town working. Going to look over the differences in the 2 posted files and hopefully keep me moving forward.
thx again, will report back.