Feels like I am trying to hit a moving target. Logging VE error

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07-09-2015
mcdonald77

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Feels like I am trying to hit a moving target. Logging VE error

I installed a new came 224/230 595/595 112 LSA. I added 2 grams to base running airflow and used a VE table that seems to be more in line them my old one.

When logging percent of error at cruise speeds my numbers jump a lot. Example. 1600rpm table about 45-60 kPa area cruise, light throttle getting .96, .95. Under a little more throttle like a slight incline those cells hit 1.0, .99. I've been using the average and multiply by half but it seems like it won't settle. I don't remember is being like this when I tuned VE and MAF for my old cam 204/218 550/550 (04 z06 cam)

The came is a lot different then the old one, could that be my issue. It's also hard to keep my IAT's down unless moving.

Motor is a 370 lq9, L92 heads with LS3 intake, DBW and LS3 injectors. I am running an AFM1600L with a new sensor. Exhaust is dual 3" with x-pipe and dual 3" black widow mufflers.

If you have a moment, take a look and give your thoughts and opinion. I am thinking of going back to my last known VE tuning file and starting over.

Attachment 51878 Attachment 51879 Attachment 51880 tune, config and log to the left
07-09-2015
5_Liter_Eater

Are those .95, .95, etc percentage of AFR error? Or lambda values?

Are you sure that you're in speed density and have fuel trims disabled?

Post a log!
07-09-2015
mcdonald77

percentage of error from lambda. The log is in the original post, title is 07-07-15.hpl

thanks for taking a look
07-10-2015
MikeOD

Can you post up a screen shot of your Lambda % error PID and any other PID's it references (like your wideband lambda PID).
07-10-2015
mcdonald77

Lambda error PID

http://i1143.photobucket.com/albums/...pscntha5mc.jpg

wide band PID
http://i1143.photobucket.com/albums/...psvswv2epi.jpg

Lambda error histogram

http://i1143.photobucket.com/albums/...psviqy78r2.jpg
07-10-2015
mcdonald77

I will double check on the speed density, my MAF table is zeroed out. Today I will make sure to hit the reset fuel trims and turn them off. Im pretty sure I did.
07-10-2015
5_Liter_Eater

Set your P0103 to MIL on first error. Without that you may not be running in SD the first time you start after flashing.
07-10-2015
MikeOD

Is USER.9004 calculating Lambda from commanded EQ ratio?

Your error PID isn't setup correct. To calculate an error PID, you want to do 100*(Actual-Commanded)/Commanded.

So if your actual is [AUX.20123] and your commanded is [USER.9004], then your PID for error should read: 100*([AUX.20123]-[USER.9004])/[USER.9004]
07-10-2015
MikeOD

I'm guessing [USER.9004] is setup with 1/EQ ratio?
07-10-2015
5_Liter_Eater

But honestly, plotting lambda against the VE, it looks pretty spot on with the exception of the 800 RPM column, and those are likely just coming back down from revving.
07-10-2015
mcdonald77

I really appreciate you guys that responded. I will give this a try tonight or in the morning. If you guys need any pin outs or wire diagrams, let me know. I can also send you some 411 ecu terminals if you want.
07-10-2015
mcdonald77

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeOD

Is USER.9004 calculating Lambda from commanded EQ ratio?

Your error PID isn't setup correct. To calculate an error PID, you want to do 100*(Actual-Commanded)/Commanded.

So if your actual is [AUX.20123] and your commanded is [USER.9004], then your PID for error should read: 100*([AUX.20123]-[USER.9004])/[USER.9004]

I meant to quote this in my last post. I will check all options given and report back. Might be a day or so but I will reply back.
07-10-2015
MikeOD

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcdonald77

I really appreciate you guys that responded. I will give this a try tonight or in the morning. If you guys need any pin outs or wire diagrams, let me know. I can also send you some 411 ecu terminals if you want.

Have you ever found which pin is flex fuel input for an E40? I know where it is on the E38 and E67...not sure what cars had an E40 and flex, but I know the PCM is capable, and it would help me.

I think your tuning will go a little smoother with that error PID setup.
07-10-2015
mcdonald77

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeOD

I'm guessing [USER.9004] is setup with 1/EQ ratio?

I had the AFX setup in Lambda before being upgraded to the afm1600L

user.9004 is [PID.6001]/14.22222 PID.6001 is Air fuel ratio commanded hi res

When I enter the above formula I get positive and negative numbers. 100*([AUX.20123]-[USER.9004])/[USER.9004] here is a screen shot of the histo..

http://i1143.photobucket.com/albums/...psr3tvb2fp.jpg
07-11-2015
Eaglegoat

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcdonald77

I had the AFX setup in Lambda before being upgraded to the afm1600L

user.9004 is [PID.6001]/14.22222 PID.6001 is Air fuel ratio commanded hi res

When I enter the above formula I get positive and negative numbers. 100*([AUX.20123]-[USER.9004])/[USER.9004] here is a screen shot of the histo..

Change your user.9004 to what he showed you.

Those positive and negative numbers are your lambda error %. Positive means you're lean and need that percentage more fuel. Negative means you are rich and need to pull that percentage of fuel.

Highlight the histogram, hit copy, highlight fuel map in editor, right click, multiply by, percentage(or half percentage). Repeat as desired.
07-11-2015
mcdonald77

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglegoat

Change your user.9004 to what he showed you.

Those positive and negative numbers are your lambda error %. Positive means you're lean and need that percentage more fuel. Negative means you are rich and need to pull that percentage of fuel.

Highlight the histogram, hit copy, highlight fuel map in editor, right click, multiply by, percentage(or half percentage). Repeat as desired.

Ahh, now it's becoming more clear. Thank you.
07-11-2015
mcdonald77

I have not, Sorry. DSteck might, he posted in another thread about adding flex non flex vehicles. I have my pid's sorted out and all is good for tuning. I was multiplying wrong when applying changes to the VE.
07-12-2015
MikeOD

Things coming together? Once you're logging correctly, you'll get it dialed in very quickly.
07-13-2015
mcdonald77

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeOD

Things coming together? Once you're logging correctly, you'll get it dialed in very quickly.

Its coming together nicely. I am working on the upper rpm levels now. Its hard to hit the higher levels on the streets. I am up to 4000 rpm. I will compare my starting and ending VE tables then scale the rest and begin working on the MAF table.
07-13-2015
mcdonald77

Here is a pic of my old VE table with the 04 Z06 cam. Even with those peaks and valleys, it drove great. I tried getting it smooth but it didn't seem to like the changes that round it all out. The second pic is where I am at now with the 224/230 595/595 cam

http://i1143.photobucket.com/albums/...psvsdzi6ij.jpg

http://i1143.photobucket.com/albums/...pshkkkipyu.jpg

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